Mid-Range Game 56: Day of Reckoning

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

Huh. Point. I'd categorised it in my head as an infolynch but you're right.

Points to V!Stick and E!Devo too for casting doubt on E!Karn, which is basically where I'm at now, regardless of that info.

Conf bias weeeeeeeeeeeee

Edited February 14, 2022 by Amanuensis

[Kasimir he/him]

9 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

Points to V!Stick and E!Devo too for casting doubt on E!Karn, which is basically where I'm at now.

I have not put too much weight on this point because in theory, any decent player should be aware of their V and E meta, even if they can't disguise it well:

Devo has been switching up her playstyle in the past game or so, but she was still distinctively in her Village meta in AG8. I would not feel powerfully confident enough about my ability to read her at all that I would stake a lynch on it, but I would not be shocked Pikachu.

Edited to add:

9 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

Conf bias weeeeeeeeeeeee

1. Tfw you casually treat the thread like a PM

2. It could be, but I think it does shape where you want to LAFO. The more I play SE, the more - as much as I am also influenced by the guilt and terror of a ML and Kas is very much a Windrunner as a Village player - I increasingly appreciate that a discussed lynch is the most powerful informative tool we have, and sometimes the only way to test your thoughts is to: A. argue with other people, and B. let reality punch you in the face by LAFO. Sometimes you really just can't tell a priori - you need empirical evidence.

Edited to add 2:

I'm not talking about myself in the third person, I promise - I was just comparing it to kel's streak of chaos.

Edited February 14, 2022 by Kasimir

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

1. Tfw you casually treat the thread like a PM

2. It could be, but I think it does shape where you want to LAFO. The more I play SE, the more - as much as I am also influenced by the guilt and terror of a ML and Kas is very much a Windrunner as a Village player - I increasingly appreciate that a discussed lynch is the most powerful informative tool we have, and sometimes the only way to test your thoughts is to: A. argue with other people, and B. let reality punch you in the face by LAFO. Sometimes you really just can't tell a priori - you need empirical evidence.

1. It's simply more fun this way

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

I have not put too much weight on this point because in theory, any decent player should be aware of their V and E meta, even if they can't disguise it well:

Devo has been switching up her playstyle in the past game or so, but she was still distinctively in her Village meta in AG8. I would not feel powerfully confident enough about my ability to read her at all that I would stake a lynch on it, but I would not be shocked Pikachu.

2. Yeah, LAFO is where I'm at rn. I've no clue how to read Devo without the knowledge of her deliberately obscuring meta, and by this point I think if she was Village, even while obscuring it, something would have pinged me in that direction. Yay PoE. I guess I'm also not a fan of the questions she's been asking me either; like it's all speculation based around alignments we don't know (which I generally find distracting rather than productive), and supports my Mat/Stick V/V feelz.

[Ashbringer he/him]

TJ open PMs already before we all go insane

... I should be asleep. Instead I have a quiz I thought was 10 minutes long but was instead 40. rip.

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Ashbringer said:

TJ open PMs already before we all go insane

... I should be asleep. Instead I have a quiz I thought was 10 minutes long but was instead 40. rip.

Maybe we should coerce the GM by ganging up on him with votes

RIP. Though I'd love to hear your thoughts on the Karn thing I pointed out, I'm a big advocate of slep. Maybe plug your phone in the wall away from your bed and force yourself to lie in the dark?

[Kasimir he/him]

7 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

1. It's simply more fun this way

2. Yeah, LAFO is where I'm at rn. I've no clue how to read Devo without the knowledge of her deliberately obscuring meta, and by this point I think if she was Village, even while obscuring it, something would have pinged me in that direction. Yay PoE. I guess I'm also not a fan of the questions she's been asking me either; like it's all speculation based around alignments we don't know (which I generally find distracting rather than productive), and supports my Mat/Stick V/V feelz.

1. This is true

2. I think someone once told me that Village runs on plausibility and Elims on possibility. One introduces doubt; one cuts down on the probability space by making assessments of likelihood/reasonableness. I think that sort of makes sense. That being said, since I haven't been able to do the hardcore analysis this game so far due to RL stuff, at least I can try to facilitate discussion - and I think it's a good lesson to (re-)learn from the mess that came out of C4 in AG8. And if I'm really wrong and it was a tunnel on Mat, and this is another tunnel, this is probably the best shot we, the Village, collectively get at working that out. Just getting people talking, answering questions, and getting the thoughts out there. But I think it's important to still make the plausibility calls, as a Villager.

3. It's interesting to consider if you're pocketing me and the rest of the thread, but I simply don't have the bandwidth to resolve this, and you seem to be chill and having fun which I think is more important, so whatever. And besides, we're only on C2, and it's not my job - there's a whole Village out there to do the thinking /shrug And if I'm Evil, I have faith that y'all will catch me soon enough if I keep talking too, so whatever  

It's nice when it's someone else's problem

3 minutes ago, Ashbringer said:

... I should be asleep. Instead I have a quiz I thought was 10 minutes long but was instead 40. rip.

4. RIP I feel u bro good luck! My exam is in two more hours and I have run out of chulls to give and am Zen.

Edited to add:

1 minute ago, Amanuensis said:

Maybe we should coerce the GM by ganging up on him with votes

Suggest a direct assault with the GoT Shame Nun :eyes:

Edited February 14, 2022 by Kasimir

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

2. I think someone once told me that Village runs on plausibility and Elims on possibility. One introduces doubt; one cuts down on the probability space by making assessments of likelihood/reasonableness. I think that sort of makes sense. That being said, since I haven't been able to do the hardcore analysis this game so far due to RL stuff, at least I can try to facilitate discussion - and I think it's a good lesson to (re-)learn from the mess that came out of C4 in AG8. And if I'm really wrong and it was a tunnel on Mat, and this is another tunnel, this is probably the best shot we, the Village, collectively get at working that out. Just getting people talking, answering questions, and getting the thoughts out there. But I think it's important to still make the plausibility calls, as a Villager.

2. The plausibility/possibility thing makes sense to me. IMO hardcore analysis is overrated anyway . As Mat proved, it comes with the expectation that every player will be logical and consistent, that they'll choose their words carefully, which Mat surely didn't while still giving me them Village feelz (which he's apparently got a history with, given his response to my tunnel by the end). Comparably, this Devo/Karn thing doesn't feel like a tunnel to me at least; I just have no other leads, and no one else seems to either, so why not, ya'know? At the end of the Cycle, we still got exe someone.

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

3. It's interesting to consider if you're pocketing me and the rest of the thread, but I simply don't have the bandwidth to resolve this, and you seem to be chill and having fun which I think is more important, so whatever. And besides, we're only on C2, and it's not my job - there's a whole Village out there to do the thinking /shrug And if I'm Evil, I have faith that y'all will catch me soon enough if I keep talking too, so whatever  

I'd be very impressed if I could pull that off after my last elim game  I definitely feel more comfortable and free in this one, which has made me aware of my failings in AG8 (like, I felt so much need as an elim to excuse myself every time I was absent, and now I really don't give a heck about how me not being around or posting looks). I also got super bogged down in ISOs I didn't even want to do but felt I needed to do to make myself look Village, and ended up being so behind that I couldn't participate much in the present, which is where I thrive as a player (TY MU Champs for introducing me to that playstyle). So basically no pocketing here, definitely not, nope, but next time I roll elim? Y'all better watch out 

 

 

[Kasimir he/him]

5 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

2. The plausibility/possibility thing makes sense to me. IMO hardcore analysis is overrated anyway . As Mat proved, it comes with the expectation that every player will be logical and consistent, that they'll choose their words carefully, which Mat surely didn't while still giving me them Village feelz (which he's apparently got a history with, given his response to my tunnel by the end). Comparably, this Devo/Karn thing doesn't feel like a tunnel to me at least; I just have no other leads, and no one else seems to either, so why not, ya'know? At the end of the Cycle, we still got exe someone.

LMAO I feel like some players gonna be twitching when they read that

But I agree, really. I think it's something my younger self didn't get and that made him awful at SE because he expected exactly that - logic, consistency, carefulness, but really we're all messy human beings and that slices through how we play in all sorts of interesting ways. Which reminds me of what Fifth said about Orlok, that he has that grace built into his playstyle to somehow allow for that messiness and fallibility and I feel like you do that deftly as well, but that's no surprise, I think  Whatever your alignment, it's at least been a pleasure to watch you at work in the thread. I'm aware one of my many weaknesses as a player is I can side-eye very strongly and deathtunnel someone for doing something I think is illogical so I usually work to hold it back.

Anyway, agreed - it's at least a D1.5 lead; in some ways this should be D2 but doesn't really feel like it because we have a lynch but the results are withheld so the result is we're in some sort of attenuated limbo. But the way to play the game is still the way it's always been. Discuss, verify, confirm.

9 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

I'd be very impressed if I could pull that off after my last elim game  I definitely feel more comfortable and free in this one, which has made me aware of my failings in AG8 (like, I felt so much need as an elim to excuse myself every time I was absent, and now I really don't give a heck about how me not being around or posting looks). I also got super bogged down in ISOs I didn't even want to do but felt I needed to do to make myself look Village, and ended up being so behind that I couldn't participate much in the present, which is where I thrive as a player (TY MU Champs for introducing me to that playstyle).

It's something I've thought about, especially when looking at one Elim doc (can't remember which) after a game, which is that y'all sometimes seem to hold yourselves more strictly than...people really do or care about. Which is odd but not surprising - self-consciousness, I suppose. In that regard, my not having been Evil in living SE memory except maybe for Sart and Araris does put me in an odd position because I will do things and genuinely not know what Evil Kas would do. Of course I can make informed guesses but those guesses are seven years out of date, and I strongly feel that you don't know until you're back in the cursed situation.

But I'm glad you're in this space. Not giving a damn and just playing it your way and doing what makes you happy is probably the way to do this. If doing all that analysis and stuff doesn't make you happy, like what's the point, you know? You're sort of signing up to torture yourself which is...just sad. And I recognise there's an element of this to what I'm doing where I'm trying to rediscover how to play a Village game that doesn't involve fifty layers of guilt and obligation, but it's good to see you have reached that level, because it gives me hope I can find my way out too

14 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

So basically no pocketing here, definitely not, nope, but next time I roll elim? Y'all better watch out 

Orlok's the one who always wanted to cross blades with you in thread This though? I think you just got Araris excited  

[Ashbringer he/him]

Hurk. That sucked.

I still haven’t fully poured through the Karn C1. They’re also entirely new in my book (only played with them as Albatross in the AG, which I don’t count because AG, Dingo, what have you), although I’ve underestimated how much they’ve actually played. That vote… doesn’t make much sense, unless they wanted info…

If you guys don’t trust it I’ll take it. But idk what that even means. I sleep now.

[Kasimir he/him]

1 minute ago, Ashbringer said:

Hurk. That sucked.

I still haven’t fully poured through the Karn C1. They’re also entirely new in my book (only played with them as Albatross in the AG, which I don’t count because AG, Dingo, what have you), although I’ve underestimated how much they’ve actually played. That vote… doesn’t make much sense, unless they wanted info…

If you guys don’t trust it I’ll take it. But idk what that even means. I sleep now.

I mean, still gotta wait to hear from Karn, IMO. More data the merrier.

But I suppose the point is - why would you vote Archer for info? Suspicion he's lying? But if you're a Village Epic, then you have prima facie evidence that Village Epics can and do exist, right? So why is it startling and what info do you really need? What info do you expect to get from an Archer lynch?

Sleep well, Ash  Thanks for joining the Thread PMs, even if Dingo ghosted my Star Wars meme PM 

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

It's something I've thought about, especially when looking at one Elim doc (can't remember which) after a game, which is that y'all sometimes seem to hold yourselves more strictly than...people really do or care about. Which is odd but not surprising - self-consciousness, I suppose. In that regard, my not having been Evil in living SE memory except maybe for Sart and Araris does put me in an odd position because I will do things and genuinely not know what Evil Kas would do. Of course I can make informed guesses but those guesses are seven years out of date, and I strongly feel that you don't know until you're back in the cursed situation.

But I'm glad you're in this space. Not giving a damn and just playing it your way and doing what makes you happy is probably the way to do this. If doing all that analysis and stuff doesn't make you happy, like what's the point, you know? You're sort of signing up to torture yourself which is...just sad. And I recognise there's an element of this to what I'm doing where I'm trying to rediscover how to play a Village game that doesn't involve fifty layers of guilt and obligation, but it's good to see you have reached that level, because it gives me hope I can find my way out too

Holy chull, 7 years??? No wonder you're traumatized in both alignments. I really think that, while you hate it because of past experiences, you desperately need an elim game to get you out of your village guilt slump. Maybe a few elim games even. I think whenever we have too long a streak in either, our growth as a player stagnates and the stress of failure accumulates. Variety is the spice of life, and alignment variety is the spice of gameplay / sanity.

Not giving a damn is great, 10/10, would recommend. Still doing something that was once fun but longer isn't is a sign of addiction and addiction is inherently self-destructive. Also expectations bad because like you pointed out, human beings are messy and can't always perform optimally, which is perfectly okay. We gotta be willing to give ourselves the same leeway that we'd give other people, which I think we both struggle doing IRL and IG.

I'm confident you'll find the zen too  just gotta follow the fun!

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

Orlok's the one who always wanted to cross blades with you in thread This though? I think you just got Araris excited  

Looking forward to it on two fronts then

 

ED1T:

Goodnight Ash! I'll probably stop constantly refreshing the page now, get something to eat, and play a few games of Valorant until more people wake up then. I'm sure people will be groaning about all the new pages we've made in their absence and will appreciate the break

Edited February 14, 2022 by Amanuensis

[Kasimir he/him]

6 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

Holy chull, 7 years??? No wonder you're traumatized in both alignments. I really think that, while you hate it because of past experiences, you desperately need an elim game to get you out of your village guilt slump. Maybe a few elim games even. I think whenever we have too long a streak in either, our growth as a player stagnates and the stress of failure accumulates. Variety is the spice of life, and alignment variety is the spice of gameplay.

Not giving a damn is great, 10/10, would recommend. Still doing something that was once fun but longer isn't is a sign of addiction and addiction is inherently self-destructive. Also expectations bad because like you pointed out, human beings are messy and can't always perform optimally, which is perfectly okay. We gotta be willing to give ourselves the same leeway that we'd give other people, which I think we both struggle doing IRL and IG.

I'm confident you'll find the zen too  just gotta follow the fun!

I don't deny you're probably right, and I think you're the...seventh? Probably? SE person to tell me I badly need an Elim game, but traumatised in both alignments probably isn't the wrong way to put it. Even as much as everything screams in me about hating Evil and that an Elim game is going to be a disaster and also, urgh, LG20/MR9 flashbacks everywhere >>

But rationally, y'all are right, yeah.

Yeah, I'm just trying to find a way out of the self-destruction. The RP didn't do it for me but apparently turning the thread into PMs works just fine  And ganging up on TJ 

Still, I'm really glad the alignment shift is doing it for you

12 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

Looking forward to it on two fronts then

Just do me a favour and NK me Night 0  It will be blissfully peaceful in the dead doc! No paranoia!  

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

Just do me a favour and NK me Night 0  It will be blissfully peaceful in the dead doc! No paranoia!  

No promises there  gotta see if I can pocket you despite the paranoia, y'know. But I promise to at least consider it

[Kasimir he/him]

2 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

No promises there  gotta see if I can pocket you despite the paranoia, y'know. But I promise to at least consider it

All I can ask :eyes:

I am the Last Son of House Urbain.

People pocket me, and I stab them in the face for it  

Bring it :eyes:

[Stick. she/her]

Uhm. I’ll go out on a limb and say Kas/Aman v/v.
Could be e/v or v/e but I’d bet against it, at least at this stage

If they end up e/e I will simply kick someone

[Kasimir he/him]

2 minutes ago, _Stick_ said:

Uhm. I’ll go out on a limb and say Kas/Aman v/v.
Could be e/v or v/e but I’d bet against it, at least at this stage

If they end up e/e I will simply kick someone

Would be a novel play, I'd grant. Pocketing the thread by bantering good-naturedly and being genuine.

Very Gaotona ¯\_㋡_/¯

Who needs bussing when you can just be bros?

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

Who needs bussing when you can just be bros?

TBH I think this just needs to be the mindset everyone approaches these games.

Friends first, Villagers/Elims second.

Gentleman Killers ya'know. Fun over victory!

[Kasimir he/him]

Just now, Amanuensis said:

TBH I think this just needs to be the mindset everyone approaches these games.

Friends first, Villagers/Elims second.

Gentleman Killers ya'know. Fun over victory!

Tbf, would be a fun way to do it E/E.

Wholesome af.

Just here to chill and play with bros  

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

Tbf, would be a fun way to do it E/E.

Oh definitely. Will have to try it some day 

[Kasimir he/him]

3 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

Oh definitely. Will have to try it some day 

Times when I hope I'm GMing rather than playing  

[STINK he/him]

For the people saying they're playing chill, do y'all just love writing essays or something

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, STINK said:

For the people saying they're playing chill, do y'all just love writing essays or something

If I like the topic, I do!

[Experience he/him]

7 hours ago, Amanuensis said:

My reads from yesterday:

Exes I'm cool with: Devo, Szeth, Tani, Mint, Dannex, probably in that order.

ED1T:

Kinda would like to give Devo more time, but also would be the most informational exe, so /shrug

Dannnex is kinda a weird one for me because I'm both leaning Village for him and pretty confident he has a role, which could be good info to have from a low-active kill, but would be me exeing a villager deliberately so doesn't feel good enough

Umm this doesn't look good to me at all. Didn't you very recently say you wanted to vote on an inactive because we don't know the info we're getting? (I know, or am pretty sure it was you, that said you wanted to vote a less active. Don't remember the exact reasoning though). But this is kind of a red flag for me cause you go on to say that you want to vote Devo cause they would be the most info. 

[Amanuensis he/him]

9 hours ago, Experience said:

Umm this doesn't look good to me at all. Didn't you very recently say you wanted to vote on an inactive because we don't know the info we're getting? (I know, or am pretty sure it was you, that said you wanted to vote a less active. Don't remember the exact reasoning though). But this is kind of a red flag for me cause you go on to say that you want to vote Devo cause they would be the most info. 

I can want to do lots of things  but I'm happiest with Devo or Karn rn

ED1T:

To clarify, y'all are seeing my solving process in real time at first I was down to aim for the low-active pool because I'm sure one of them is an elim, but that essentially boils down to a guessing game with little gain if they are Village. Meanwhile, I've worked my way to feeling pretty good about one of Devo/Karn being elim, if not both, and they've both done more to analyze. Plus I highly doubt they're both Village, so by encouraging both exes simultaneously, we should see who the elims favor.

Or, better put, it's not even about info gain. It's about using the exe on the best elim!candidate.

Edited February 14, 2022 by Amanuensis

[Orlok Tsubodai he/him]

I'm not sure I'll continue the spreadsheet analysis beyond the end of D1, as it takes ~90 minutes per page of thread, but have progressed it, and will post what I have for now.

Full, in a spoiler box as have posted first 102 posts already:

Spoiler

Cycle	Post	Player	Summary	Vote	Retractions	Thoughts	AI (perceived)	Notable connections
One	1	TJ	Writeup	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	2	Experience	Asks if PMs are open	N/A	N/A	Trivial to check in rules. Performative?	Mild evil	None
One	3	TJ	Clarifies that PMs are closed	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	4	Kasimir	Answers Experience, says PMs default closed, but may open.	N/A	N/A	Has read rules	NAI	None
One	5	Ashbringer	Poke vote on Matrim's Dice, no content	Matrim's Dice	N/A	Prepared to vote early	Unsure	Votes on Matrim's Dice
One	6	Archer	Suggests wording of TJ's PM clarification makes a PM role less likely, but that they had been assuming one. Votes on Kas. RP	Kasimir	N/A	Blackout game - interesting to assume anything. Reason for making speculation public? Vote on Kas - who has engaged. Value? Not putting pressure as not given reason, so why Kas? Ask.	Very mild evil	Votes on Kasimir
One	7	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Asks how this works, says first game, needs to know ehther we vote each post	N/A	N/A	Consider giving benefit of doubt. However, reading even one page of one game would give answer to this, feels very much like playing up being new	Moderate evil	None
One	8	Kasimir	RP, poke vote on Devotary. Asks TJ to get IM to give Thaidakar information on how to play. Tells Thaidakar how to vote.	Devotary	N/A	Feels genuine re Thaidakar - might be prepared to rule out Thaidakar/Kasimir e/e. Doesn't address Archer, but nothing to address	If Thaidakar evil, moderate village	Helpful/genuine to Thaidakar, poke votes Devotary
One	9	Experience	Quotes Archer RP, thinks they've found "the krrok", votes on Archer. RPs	Archer	N/A	Presume vote is RP related, not sure I follow. Archer not unreasonable vote given vote on Kas	Likely NAI	Votes on Archer
One	10	Illwei	Votes on Dannnex	Dannnex	N/A	Poke vote	NAI	Votes on Dannnex
One	11	Experience	Makes bad joke about Illwei's post	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	12	Illwei	Suggests Experience's joke is a dad joke	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	13	Ashbringer	Answers Thaidakar about whether they have to vote in every post	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	Helpful to Thaidakar
One	14	Dannnex	Votes on TJ, suggests it's a joke	TJ	N/A	Has worked in some games, doesn't contribute to thread	NAI	None
One	15	Matrim's Dice	Votes on Thaidakar, says "hi", doesn't want to kill them, asks if they've read the rules/etiquette thread. Will RP, is glad that there won't be D1 distro discussion	Thaidakar	N/A	Friendly post. Agree that distribution discussion often of limited value.	NAI	Friendly vote on Thaidakar
One	16	Stick	Multiquotes a number of posts. Agrees with Archer that PMs might come from an event. Explains how game works to Thaidakar.	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	17	TJ	Unimpressed meme in response to Dannnex's vote	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	18	Kasimir	Makes joke in response to TJ meme	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	19	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Votes on Dannnex, clarifies they do not want to kill them	Dannnex	N/A	Unsure. Could be eliminator overworrying about poke vote, or could be villager not understanding meta. Why Dannnex?	Unsure	Votes on Dannnex
One	20	Archer	Says last game e!JNV was asking questions like that (like what? Presume like one asked by Thaidakar?). Suggests non-partisan assistance the way to go. Asks if anyone else got a weirdly specific role TJ is PAFOing questions about. Asks Thaidakar what their plan is given their clarification about Dannnex	N/A	N/A	Making role claim of game material consequence. Baiting a kill/pretending to to justify not being attacked later on? More likely latter, could equally be baiting roles investigating to discover targets?	Very mild village	None
One	21	Stick	Comments on TJ's meme	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	22	Matrim's Dice	Asks for clarification from Archer on e!JNV	N/A	N/A	Fair question	None	Less likely e!Matrim/e!Archer
One	23	Kasimir	Comments on Archer's thoughts on Thaidakar/JNV parallels. Questions whether Thaidakar playing up new player image, considers it currently NAI	N/A	N/A	Agree worth acknowledging possibility.	NAI	Acknowledges possibility of e!Thaidakar
One	24	Archer	Says they didn't mean JNV but meant JungleFiend	N/A	N/A	Verifiable	NAI	None
One	25	Stick	Quotes aArcher, notes their role claim. Also claims to have been bombarding TJ with questions, and to have recieved PAFOs in response.	N/A	N/A	Also, therefore, claiming a role. Question whether gained any information more widely useful from questions. If claiming early possession of role, then potential target regardless - value in claiming specifics of role? Unless knows game role madness (TMI?) and therefore feels safe claiming?	Mild evil	Questions Archer
One	26	TJ	Clarifies meme	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	27	Szeth Pancakes	Explicit poke vote on StrikerEZ	StrikerEZ	N/A	None	NAI	Poke votes on StrikerEZ
One	28	Matrim's Dice	Has asked GM question that wasn't PAFO'd.	N/A	N/A	What was question about?	NAI	None
One	29	Kasimir	Expresses incredulity at questions being asked	N/A	N/A	Attempting to suggest no role?	NAI	None
One	30	Ashbringer	Comments on Fog/Frog confusion	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	31	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Responds to Archer, says they said they didn't want to kill Dannnex when voting on them because Dannnex said the same to them	N/A	N/A	Feels genuine, mistaken about who voted on them	Mild village	None
One	32	Stick	Says asking questions knowing they'll receive PAFOs, asking anyway	N/A	N/A	Reinforcing roleclaim?	Unsure	None
One	33	TJ	Comments on title confusion	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	34	Devotary	RP, votes on Ashbringer for RP reasons	Ashbringer	N/A	Reasonable poke vote target	NAI	Poke/RP vote on Ashbringer
One	35	Kasimir	Makes comments on title puns	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	36	Tani	Questions TJ about his meme	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	37	Dannnex	Tells Thaidakar it was Matrim's Dice who voted on them	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	38	Matrim's Dice	Corrects Thaidakar about having voted on them. Suggests Szeth's poke vote might be a Szeth elim tell, but could just be normal behaviour	N/A	N/A	Gut dislike of equivocation on Szeth	Very mild evil	None
One	39	Kasimir	Quotes Matrim's Dice about Szeth, retracts on Devotary, votes on Matrim.	Matrim's Dice	Devotary	If vote is from quote, understandable	Very mild good	Votes on Matrim's Dice
One	40	Illwei	Doesn't believe Thaidakar e/e with Dannnex or Matrim's Dice. Thinks Matrim probably village for not voting on Szeth	N/A	N/A	I disliked the equivocation on Szeth, but can see how it could be seen as uncertain villager. Agree re Thaidakar. Attempt to solve game	Mild good	Matrim more likely village
One	41	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Apologises for getting Matrim and Dannnex confused, says their head exploded from amount they're keeping track of	N/A	N/A	Not sure too much to keep track of at this point?	Mild evil	None
One	42	Matrim's Dice	RP. Replies to Kasimir about a "shuffle squat"	N/A	N/A	Unsure what they're referring to	NAI	None
One	43	Kasimir	Questions Matrim about his Szeth equivocation	N/A	N/A	Agree worth probing	Unsure	Interrogating Matrim
One	44	Archer	Quotes Devotary's RP, asks them whether they're claiming not to be an epic. Says Matrim's take is interesting	N/A	N/A	Reinforces claim to be an Epic. Question why insistent on role claiming	Unsure	None
One	45	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Votes on Archer	Archer	Dannnex	Archer definitely up to something, unsure whether villager gambit or elim. Absence of justification makes me suspect less likely elim jumping on this	Moderate village	Votes on Archer
One	46	Matrim's Dice	Meant that they thought Szeth's poke vote was just something Szeth does. Asks Thaidakar why they voted on Archer	N/A	N/A	Unclear therefore why they posted it	Mild evil	None
One	47	Devotary	Responds to Archer, says that Reckoners are famously not Epics.	N/A	N/A	Not a village aligned Epic, isn't aware of them	Very marginally more likely evil	None
One	48	Tani	Votes on TJ	TJ	N/A	Not useful	NAI	None
One	49	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Says vote on Archer due to gut	N/A	N/A	Feels good from new player - I think an elim more likely to justify themselves	Mild village	None
One	50	Araris	RP. Suggests Thaidakar be responsible with vote placing. Assists Kas with "shuffle thing" votes on Mat	Matrim's Dice	N/A	Equally, voting gives more information to consider. What is meant by shuffle thing?	Unsure	Votes on Matrim's Dice
One	51	Stick	Votes on Tani, makes joke about them wanting a train on TJ	Tani	N/A	Not a serious vote	NAI	Joke vote on Tani
One	52	Experience	Asks whether Archer has an Epic role they want to tell us about	N/A	N/A	Archer has been hinting at a role - worth questioning it. Think questioning it is NAI. Also unaware of village aligned Epics - marginally more likely to be evil	NAI	Questions Archer
One	53	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Reacts to Araris with alarm, says did not realise vote is tool meant to kill someone	N/A	N/A	Respectfully, fairly basic part of game that vote to lynch. Feels like performative overreaction	Moderate evil	None
One	54	Matrim's Dice	Replies to Araris, suggests voting also a tool to gauge reactions to being voted on, takes Thaidakar's misunderstanding at face value. Says only they and Kas can shuffle.	N/A	N/A	Agree re voting as tool for information	NAI	None
One	55	Ashbringer	Points out that Matrim has three votes on them	N/A	N/A	Themself included as a poke vote. Why leaving vote on given build up of votes?	Unsure. Not sure Matrim feels under pressure, why leave vote on?	None
One	56	Araris	Says they can also shuffle with Kas. Asks Ashbringer who the third vote is	N/A	N/A	Keep the flirting out of thread, gentlemen.	NAI	None
One	57	Ashbringer	Says they were first vote on Matrim	N/A	N/A	Continued absence of justification for prolonged poke vote	Very mild evil	None
One	58	Stick	Says they were ninja'd by Araris, and missed Ashbringer's vote	N/A	N/A	Fair enough	NAI	None
One	59	Araris	Suggests thread should put more votes on other players	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	60	Experience	Votes on Araris	Araris	N/A	Feels like vote purely responsive	NAI	None
One	61	Matrim's Dice	Says they've been the leading train two hours into in D1 six times, has been lynched D1 once	N/A	N/A	Feels unconcerned by pressure, think NAI - vote lead two hours into D1 unlikely to hold as they point out	NAI	None
One	62	Araris	Insists on being voted on, isn't often voted out D1, is in LG	N/A	N/A	Nonchalance about being voted out	Probably NAI	None
One	63	Stick	Wary of Experience and Thaidakar, attributes it to gut	N/A	N/A	Agree re both	Mild village	Wary of Thaidakar and Experience
One	64	Experience	Offers Stick a cookie to assuage their gut	N/A	N/A	Not worried about it	Very mild village	None
One	65	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Is also beginning to think Experience is suspicious	N/A	N/A	Agree, want to see reasoning. Reactive to Stick's suspicion?	Mild evil	Suspicious of Experience
One	66	Ashbringer	Asks whether people mind mind games.	N/A	N/A	Point of asking?	Unsure	None
One	67	Experience	RP	N/A	N/A	NAI	NAI	None
One	68	Matrim's Dice	Gut village of Stick, Ashbringer, TJ. Null on Thaidakar and Araris, thinks Kas and Experience feel normal, but that that's not necessarily village, might be in Kas' case	N/A	N/A	Would question gut takes, now seen Matrim's alignment.	Known non-village	See post
One	69	Experience	Notes Matrim included GM in village reads	N/A	N/A	NAI	NAI	None
One	70	Araris	Matrim putting GM in village reads makes them want to leave their vote on them	N/A	N/A	Not sure I see it as anything more than a joke	Very mild evil	None
One	71	Ashbringer	Says hello to Striker	N/A	N/A	Presume Striker was viewing the thread	NAI	None
One	72	Striker	RP. Votes on Matrim's Dice as one of the times they vote on them early in D1 exe has to be right. Has bad gut read on them. Says will disappear for a while after post. Asks for vote count	Matrim's Dice	N/A	Obviously (and probably deliberately) poor logic for vote on Matrim's Dice. Why ask for vote count if disappearing?	Gut mild evil	Votes on Matrim's Dice
One	73	Tani	"VC: Numbers"	N/A	N/A	Joke	NAI	None
One	74	TUA	RP. Says they should add game comments, but don't have any. Might just RP and chill	N/A	N/A	If not going to make comments, not contributing as village, impossible to solve. Should policy lynch at appropriate point	Functionally not village	None
One	75	Matrim's Dice	Says they're aware that TJ is the GM, and putting them as village was taking an active stance against people voting for him. Points out that Striker's logic on voting for him based on past games is flawed. Says amazing that can get village read in one game and elim read in another without changing playstyle. Says Striker objectively wrong to claim they're not talking to anyone	N/A	N/A	Unlikely that eliminators woudl actively seek to change their playstyle. Feels slightly performative, moot point, known non village. Think Striker's point was RP only?	Known non-village	None
One	76	Illwei	Thinks Experience and Araris village. Thinks Thaidakar not e/e with Matrim, Dannnex, or Stick, Experience not e/e with Araris or Archer, Ashbringer not e/e with Striker. Leaning village on Ashbringer for poking Striker when Striker was viewing the thread, thinks NAI in reality. Suspicious of Kasimir for attempt to appear normal	N/A	N/A	Would like to see justifications for team exclusions. Need to check notes, agree with at least some, but would be helpful to have called out what they're reliant on. Like being clear with reads.	Mild village	See post
One	77	Archer	Says they are an epic, wants to figure out if everyone is an Epic. Claims their role is that they can ask dead people questions if their alignment hasn't been confirmed. Asks if anyone is not an epic	N/A	N/A	Bold to assume everyone an Epic from their own role. Unsure where additional information from. If role true, feels more likely village aligned than elim aligned. Odd role to make up, easily verifiable.	Don't think an eliminator would know immediately that village aligned epics exist pre-D1 lynch. Moderately hard clear village?	Sceptical of Devotary
One	78	Illwei	Tells people not to answer Archer asking if anyone isn't an Epic	N/A	N/A	Agree generally with wisdom of not roleclaiming, dislike Illwei asserting it as wisdom - both useful to see who makes claims, and potentially claiming cred for saying village-like things	Mild evil	None
One	79	TUA	Claims to be a regular	N/A	N/A	Don't think AI. Could be villager seeking to make themselves less of a target (not sure villagers actually should do so), or elim seeking to avoid havign to explain actions down the road	NAI	None
One	80	Archer	Votes on Illwei, as thinks they have said previously that secrecy of blackout distributions favours eliminators.	Illwei	Kasimir	Actions consistent with stated beliefs. Feels genuine.	Moderate village	Votes on Illwei
One	81	STINK	Asks whether it's worth them reading the last four pages	N/A	N/A	Always, but not inconsistent with historic playstyle	NAI	None
One	82	Matrim's Dice	Doesn't know how Archer could confirm no vanilla roles without access to the player list.	N/A	N/A	Known non-village	Known non-village	None
One	83	Striker	Responds to Matrim, says not talking to anyone was RP reason for vote. Retracts from Matrim, votes on Stink	STINK	Matrim's Dice	Why retract vote? One substantive Matrim post in interim - what in it made them retract? Stink being consistent - easy vote?	Mild evil	Votes on Stink
One	84	Matrim's Dice	Acknowledges Striker's RP	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	85	STINK	Quotes Striker's vote, "Truly great to be back"	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	86	Devotary	Replies to Archer, says it is their RP character who isn't an Epic. Says bold move for Archer to claim Epic in game where elim team are corrupted Epics	N/A	N/A	Actively isn't claiming vanilla. Not sure Epic claim if elims listed as corrupted Epics is so bold - question what Devotary meant by this.	Gut moderate evil	Sus of Archer?
One	87	Experience	Elims being "corrupted" epics leads them to think there are some villager epics	N/A	N/A	Very fair assumption. Reassess alignment indicativeness of Archer claim. Read rules in greater depth myself next game.	NAI	None
One	88	Matrim's Dice	Elims being corrupted epics not just epics, villagers being Reckoner Allies not Reckoners implies village epics, ninja'd by Experience	N/A	N/A	Very fair assumption. Reassess alignment indicativeness of Archer claim. Read rules in greater depth myself next game.	Known non-village	None
One	89	Striker	Trivial reply to STINK	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	90	TUA	Is claiming regular	N/A	N/A	None new	NAI	None
One	91	Devotary	Expects a higher percentage of epics than regulars to be eliminators. Non-epics on corrupted epics team would be funny	N/A	N/A	Possibly, but more villagers than elims, so epic not necessarily more likely to be elim than village. Don't think it justifies assessment of Archer's claim as bold	Mild evil	None
One	92	Stick	Expresses incredulity at Archer's claim, suggests they might be setting themself up for the night kill. Says we shouldn't be mass claiming	N/A	N/A	Gut read as performative	Mild evil	None
One	93	Ashbringer	Says we need Elims to claim Reckoners, or what Devotary said	N/A	N/A	Not quite sure I follow	Unsure	None
One	94	Archer	Isn't sure whether Devotary elim or vanilla villager. Thinks some level of claiming necessary in blackout gain to understand the game. Had initially assumed everyone was an Epic, thinks TUA's defence of Devotary so indirect it felt genuine.	N/A	N/A	Agree re interrogation of Devotary. Why assume everyone an Epic based on their own role - feels odd. But again, odder to assume as an eliminator.	Mild village	Suspicious of Devotary
One	95	Illwei	Blackout of all information favours eliminators, but this does not mean total openness favours village. Village claims narrow NK possibilities for eliminators. Will treat further elim claims as elim.	N/A	N/A	Very odd to say vanilla claims will be read as evil. Feels llike threat to make people not claim, as not reliable alignment-discerning tool, which Illwei must know. Plausible to want to dissuade village claims regardless of alignment	Mild evil from coercion	None
One	96	TJ	Vote count	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	97	Ashbringer	Says we should be cautious nitpicking GM PMs, and thinks doing so might be against the rules	N/A	N/A	Not sure spirit of the rules precludes questioning GM in blackout game, if so, poorly written rule.	NAI	None
One	98	TUA	Says they may have stepped over the line of not nitpicking GM PMs	N/A	N/A	Not sure they did	NAI	None
One	99	STINK	Thought game would have PMs	N/A	N/A	Indirectly implying no doc to chat in? Plausibly performative	Unsure	None
One	100	Matrim's Dice	Asks whether there are neutral roles, as factions section of rules is definitive. Doesn't see a reason not to vote for Dannnex, votes for them	Dannnex	Thaidakar	Why would GM give clarity in blackout game. Known non-village, suggests thought of themselves as neutral	Known non-village	None
One	101	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Asks how much RP this game involves, and whether they should RP	N/A	N/A	Can read thread and see not everyone RPing - performative? Unsure	Unsure	None
One	102	Matrim's Dice	Tells Thaidakar that RP is optional, encourages them to introduce their character	N/A	N/A	NAI	Known non-village	None
One	103	Archer	Asks Stink if they would like a PM from a PM person. Thinks Matrim worded joke about GM to avoid suggesting being in the elim doc. Raises the question of what TJ did that makes this game blackout. Tells Thaidakar to RP if they want to, and that it normally makes up less than 20% of posted content	N/A	N/A	Claiming PM ability? Query what they meant here. Not sure I buy wording point - feels overly uncharitable explanation. Tunnelling villager? Consider elim seeking to cement D1 safe lynch	Gut mild village	Tunnelling on Matrim's Dice
One	104	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Thanks Archer for RP advice, says they will get better at game as they understand it more	N/A	N/A	Trying to read charitably, remain concerned that overdoing being a new player	Mild evil	None
One	105	Illwei	Thinks Experience, Araris and Archer are village. Thinks Stick is an elim. Believes Thaidakar isn't teamed with Mat, Dannnex or Stick, Exprerience isn't e/e with Araris or Archer, and Ashbringer not e/e with Striker. Thinks Ashbringer village for prodding Striker whilst they were viewing thread. Suspicious of Kas for trying to seem normal. Thinks Stick is an elim because interacting but not providing thoughts Thinks Archer's point on Matrim comes from a village perspective. Says you can't read into Stink wanting PMs, but if STINK is evil wonders about number of elims had checked in by then	N/A	N/A	Read Illwei as village. Agree with much of thought process re Archer, like the exclusionary connections	Moderate village	See post
One	106	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Asks what an elim is	N/A	N/A	Very much feels over-playign being new. Elims is a very natural shortening for Eliminators, with plenty of context, and Eliminators as evil players is very clear at top of rules doc, which they say they read. New/inexperienced does not mean has no reading comprehension	Strong evil. Don't like lynching new players early, but shouldn't give them a free pass either	None
One	107	Dannnex	Tells Thaidakar what an eliminator is	N/A	N/A	Less likely e/e with Thaidakar	NAI	Less likely e/e with Thaidakar
One	108	STINK	Reiterates what RP is, says they'd welcome a PM, jokes about structure of Illwei's post	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	109	Matrim's Dice	Replies to Archer's suggestion they deliberately worded post to avoid mentioning elim doc. Doesn't think liek that when elim, thinks more likely to reword as village to avoid seeming like elim. Doesn't think there has to be something that makes it mandatory that it's blackout, though there probably is	N/A	N/A	Dislike point about self meta. Feels too defensive when point made is spurious anyway	Mild evil	None
One	110	Illwei	Retracts on Dannnex, votes on Stick	Stick	Dannnex	Consistent with prior post	NAI	Votes on Stick
One	111	Szeth Pancakes	Going to be low activity because of life	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	112	Archer	RP	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	113	Experience	Asks people to PM them if they can. No new thoughts, wants to review Illwei if Stick or Dannnex flip elim	N/A	N/A	Trying to imply Illwei/Dannnex team? Knowledge that one of Stick/Dannex evil?	Very mild evil	None
One	114	Illwei	Asks Experience why they think Illwei would vote for teammates off the bat D1	N/A	N/A	Distancing, but fair point to raise - is an odd singular thought to have	Very mild good	None
One	115	Experience	Doesn't think Illwei is voting for teammates, but was making a mental note based off a gut feeling	N/A	N/A	Was making an explicit, not a mental note.	Very mild evil	None
One	116	Matrim's Dice	Reading Experience as solidly village. Disagrees with Illwei about Stick being elim	N/A	N/A	Gut dislike post	Unsure	Reads Experience village, Stick not elim
One	117	Illwei	Asks Mat why they think Experience is solidly village	N/A	N/A	Question worth asking	Mild good	None
One	118	Tani	Claims to be Epic called ricochet. Asks whether red highlit roles can be villagers	N/A	N/A	Not first Epic claim, elim team now aware of villae epics. Think question about red likely misinterpretation. Question why making claim	Unsure, gut village	None
One	119	Matrim's Dice	Says thinks Experience village because of their type of post - suggests when they're an elim they avoid posting random takes and do less fluff, thinks e!Experience might be more reserved	N/A	N/A	Gut strong dislike of bringing up own elim meta	Moderate evil	Thinks Experience village
One	120	JNV	RP, is suspicious of Thaidakar for being too clueless. Doesn't remember being that confused when new, but thinks it could happen so won't vote for them	N/A	N/A	Agree strongly, not e/e with Thaidakar	Moderate village	Not e/e with Thaidakar, thinks Thaidakar acting too confused
One	121	Experience	Is cglad to be acting like v!Mat	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	122	Matrim's Dice	Thought Thaidakar just didn't read the rules. Agrees you should probably know what an elim is after reading main intro page, thinks that leans into territory of assuming how someone learns.	N/A	N/A	Agree that being charitable important, think not knowing what elim is is going too far. New does not equal unintelligent. If evil, look much more heavily at Thaidakar	Mild-moderate evil	Defending Thaidakar
One	123	Tani	RPs as Ricochet	N/A	N/A	Is ricochet just RP character or is it a roleclaim?	Unsure	None
One	124	Kasimir	Thinks Devotary's comment on taking out epics on principle is RP reason, comments on Archer pushing on it. Thinsk Devotary/Archer exchange is odd. Thinks Experience asking Archer whether they have an Epic roles comes from village perspective that Epics = bad. Has negative gut read of Thaidakar because feels like they're playing things up. Is suspicious of Araris for inviting D1 votes. Thinks Thaidakar's suspicions of Experience feel like sheeping. Dislikes Archer's claim, but thinks it is in character for them. Is interested that Illwei defensive about voting for teammates D1 - says they did so LG78 and LG74. Votes Karnatheon because they were viewing thread	Karnatheon	N/A	Agree re negative gut read of Thaidakar. Disagree with reads of Experience and Illwei. Gut dislike of tone which I can't put my finger on.	Gut mild evil	Negative gut read of Thaidakar, defence of Devotary, Experience, sus of Illwei?
One	125	Experience	Isn't complaining about being village read by Matrim	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	126	Elandera	IM reminder	IM	IM	IM	IM	IM
One	127	Araris	Thinks Matrim's reads list felt insincere	N/A	N/A	Fair enough	Mild village	None
One	128	Kasimir	Has bad gut read on Araris and Thaidakar, won't push Araris on their gut whilst sticking to their own	N/A	N/A	Is read on Thaidakar gut? Or downplaying it having called it out as distancing?	Very mild evil	Bad gut read of Araris and Thaidakar
One	129	Devotary	Thinks all corrupted epics will be epics, therefore the elim epic/villager epic ratio much higher than elim regular/village regular ratio. Won't clear anyone for not being an Epic, but can't see corrupted epics not having epics	N/A	N/A	Walking back claim within same post as suggesting elims have no regulars.	Moderate evil	None
One	130	Illwei	Says question about voting D1 was specifically to Experience, who was on team with them when they bussed D1. Thinks it was an odd thing for Experience to say. Thinks people commenting on epics being bad is an elim slip from not realising epics aren't just evil	N/A	N/A	Fair enough re Experience. Had same thought process on epics = bad - whilst I'm not sure it is an elim slip necessarily, think thought process of Illwei's comes from villager.	Moderate village	None
One	131	Striker	Retracts from Stink, votes on Illwei	Illwei	STINK	No justification, think Illwei's points have made sense - why the vote?	Mild evil	Votes on Illwei
One	132	Matrim's Dice	Asks Kas whether they think Devotary/Archer exhancge is e/e. Says that Kas' point re Thaidakar was one made by JNV, which they agreed with. Liked how Stick was interacting with thread. Doubts they'll seriously elim read Kas because they're just too villagery. Thinks Striker is village	N/A	N/A	Dislike strongly the village read on Kas. e/e? Reason for thinkign Striker village?	Mild evil	Reads Kas and Striker as village
One	133	Striker	Says they're indeed a villager	N/A	N/A	Joke, NAI	NAI	None
One	134	Ashbringer	Idea about alignments lying to us got stuck in head with Archer's claim. Wonders whether villagers all epics, elims all not. Says would fall apart upon claiming.	N/A	N/A	Think very heavily overthinking	Unsure	None
One	135	Araris	Thinks village roles all differing from elim roles does not necessarily entail game being solvable	N/A	N/A	Fair point, particularly in backout with no roles confirmed to exist	NAI	None
One	136	Szeth Pancakes	Retracts from Striker quoting their post	N/A	Striker	Why retract on basis of that post?	Unsure	None
One	137	Experience	Responds to Illwei, thinks they might have D1 voted teammates becuase they did that in game Experience and Illwei were e/e	N/A	N/A	Gut read that post feels slightly off	Gut mild evil	None
One	138	Amanuensis	RP. Vote count, votes on Matrim's Dice	Matrim's Dice	N/A	Unexplained, puts Matrim ahead of Archer	Unsure	Votes on Matrim's Dice, breaking tie with Archer
One	139	Karnatheon	Votes on Archer for claiming Epic, says whether irs alignment indicative or not would get information in blackout situation. Asks Tani whether they're also claiming an Epic or whether they were establishing RP character	Archer	N/A	Very strongly dislike vote. Particularly with Archer's claimed role, information motivated vote does not feel justified	Moderate evil	Votes on Archer
One	140	TJ	Corrects Amanuensis' vote count	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	141	Kasimir	Replies to Devotary. Thinks even if all elims are epics, the monent we discard assumption that all villagers non-epic, we are committed to significant, non-zero number of village epics. Can see Illwei's point re Experience. Asks Striker to explain their vote on Illwei. HAs no opinion on whether Archer/Devotary exchange is e/e. Thinks reading Devotary's claim as RP is natural read of it. Thinks Thaidakar's voting inconsistent with amount of newness they claim. Stick hasn't popped out to them. Returns to village epic debate. If Archer's claim plausible, and plausible that Archer not evil, then committed to not being able to draw epic/non-Epic line in terms of roles/alignments. Finds idea intuitively compelling. Finds it too strong to assume all epics are evil, wants to know base rate of epic occurrence to make claims about whether a given Epic is more likely to be village or not. Thinks Devo/Archer/Illwei discussion, however, is hinged on wgat elims would perceive the safe thing to say is - would a villager be more likely to think that Epics are likely to be evil? Think if elims have regulars, less likely to worry about suggesting village epics. If elim team all epics, reasinable for them to be cautious about claiming village epics. Thinks elims would want to stay away from Epic claims, suggests Devotary agrees. Notes category of players who believe people who claim epics are evil are sus, puts Illwei and Archer in this category, suggests Matrim's Dice and Experience both also push back against this idea. Thinks Experience, Karnatheon, and possibly TUA believe epics are evil. Asks Ashbringer and Amanuensis their views. Has negative read on Experience for pushing Archer on their Epic claim whilst pushign back on the idea that epics are evil. Negative on Thaidakar for overly claiming newness. Negative gut on Araris. Cricket meme(?) on Archer. Positive on Devotary, rethinking. Light positive on Aman and Illwei	N/A	N/A	If of the view that elims would want to stay away from epic claims, committed to Archer not being elim? Suggests that it is not intuitive that epics can be good. Large amount of time spent considering this. Think view on Archer inconistent with positions stated in this post	Mild/moderate evil	See post
One	142	Ashbringer	Thinks Archer's claim is bold for a lie, but that it's a long shot to bluff. Says theyd be group A (believes elims would want to stay far away from epic claims or view that epics can be good) but says epics may be good but may be not. Says Archer is on thin ice.	N/A	N/A	Feels like miunderstood group A (or maybe I have) but to suggest claim is bold for a lie and then that Archer is on thin ice feels inconsistent	Mild evil	Thinsk Archer is on thin ice
One	143	Kasimir	Memes	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	144	Amanuensis	Believes Archer is a village epic, not necessarily their role details. Also believes TUA is a regular villager	N/A	N/A	Agreed on both	Mild village	Believes Archer and TUA are village
One	145	Kasimir	Says gut read on Aman due to similarities with MR38 playstyle. Thinsk unease of Araris because he's giving LG78/MR52 vibes	N/A	N/A	Recall Kas saying in AG8 they had difficulty reading Araris - interesting to find they now feel more confident	Unsure	None
One	146	TJ	Off topic	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	147	Amanuensis	Mat has stood out to them, is preferred lynch, would be cool with Dannnex lynch	N/A	N/A	Would like to see reasons	Unsure	Wants to lynch Matrim's Dice, content to lynch Dannnex
One	148	Kasimir	Asks Aman for reasoning of their reads	N/A	N/A	NAI	NAI	None
One	149	Stick	If Archer is village, elims are considering his claim, so we should too. Doesn't think v!Archer would be lying. Doesn't think e!Archer would truthfully make claim of what role entails. Thinks Archer likely village. Suggests Archer might be neutral. Questions whether Thaidakar playing newbie card. Thinks something off about Experience asking players to PM them. Thinks Kas wrong to say that Experience believing epics = elims = bad comes from village perspective - thinks more likely to come from elim. Gut reads Illwei as village. Wants to give Thaidakar the benefit of the doubt but sus. Votes for Experience	Experience	Tani	Would like to see suspicion of Experience made more explicit, believe it is due to PM post and their view that epics = elims? Check if view consistently applied. Archer neutrality to reduce value of consensus cleared villager?	Unsure	Votes on Experience, village reads Archer

New content:

Cycle	Post	Player	Summary	Vote	Retractions	Thoughts	AI (perceived)	Notable connections
One	1	TJ	Writeup	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	2	Experience	Asks if PMs are open	N/A	N/A	Trivial to check in rules. Performative?	Mild evil	None
One	3	TJ	Clarifies that PMs are closed	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	4	Kasimir	Answers Experience, says PMs default closed, but may open.	N/A	N/A	Has read rules	NAI	None
One	5	Ashbringer	Poke vote on Matrim's Dice, no content	Matrim's Dice	N/A	Prepared to vote early	Unsure	Votes on Matrim's Dice
One	6	Archer	Suggests wording of TJ's PM clarification makes a PM role less likely, but that they had been assuming one. Votes on Kas. RP	Kasimir	N/A	Blackout game - interesting to assume anything. Reason for making speculation public? Vote on Kas - who has engaged. Value? Not putting pressure as not given reason, so why Kas? Ask.	Very mild evil	Votes on Kasimir
One	7	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Asks how this works, says first game, needs to know ehther we vote each post	N/A	N/A	Consider giving benefit of doubt. However, reading even one page of one game would give answer to this, feels very much like playing up being new	Moderate evil	None
One	8	Kasimir	RP, poke vote on Devotary. Asks TJ to get IM to give Thaidakar information on how to play. Tells Thaidakar how to vote.	Devotary	N/A	Feels genuine re Thaidakar - might be prepared to rule out Thaidakar/Kasimir e/e. Doesn't address Archer, but nothing to address	If Thaidakar evil, moderate village	Helpful/genuine to Thaidakar, poke votes Devotary
One	9	Experience	Quotes Archer RP, thinks they've found "the krrok", votes on Archer. RPs	Archer	N/A	Presume vote is RP related, not sure I follow. Archer not unreasonable vote given vote on Kas	Likely NAI	Votes on Archer
One	10	Illwei	Votes on Dannnex	Dannnex	N/A	Poke vote	NAI	Votes on Dannnex
One	11	Experience	Makes bad joke about Illwei's post	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	12	Illwei	Suggests Experience's joke is a dad joke	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	13	Ashbringer	Answers Thaidakar about whether they have to vote in every post	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	Helpful to Thaidakar
One	14	Dannnex	Votes on TJ, suggests it's a joke	TJ	N/A	Has worked in some games, doesn't contribute to thread	NAI	None
One	15	Matrim's Dice	Votes on Thaidakar, says "hi", doesn't want to kill them, asks if they've read the rules/etiquette thread. Will RP, is glad that there won't be D1 distro discussion	Thaidakar	N/A	Friendly post. Agree that distribution discussion often of limited value.	NAI	Friendly vote on Thaidakar
One	16	Stick	Multiquotes a number of posts. Agrees with Archer that PMs might come from an event. Explains how game works to Thaidakar.	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	17	TJ	Unimpressed meme in response to Dannnex's vote	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	18	Kasimir	Makes joke in response to TJ meme	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	19	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Votes on Dannnex, clarifies they do not want to kill them	Dannnex	N/A	Unsure. Could be eliminator overworrying about poke vote, or could be villager not understanding meta. Why Dannnex?	Unsure	Votes on Dannnex
One	20	Archer	Says last game e!JNV was asking questions like that (like what? Presume like one asked by Thaidakar?). Suggests non-partisan assistance the way to go. Asks if anyone else got a weirdly specific role TJ is PAFOing questions about. Asks Thaidakar what their plan is given their clarification about Dannnex	N/A	N/A	Making role claim of game material consequence. Baiting a kill/pretending to to justify not being attacked later on? More likely latter, could equally be baiting roles investigating to discover targets?	Very mild village	None
One	21	Stick	Comments on TJ's meme	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	22	Matrim's Dice	Asks for clarification from Archer on e!JNV	N/A	N/A	Fair question	None	Less likely e!Matrim/e!Archer
One	23	Kasimir	Comments on Archer's thoughts on Thaidakar/JNV parallels. Questions whether Thaidakar playing up new player image, considers it currently NAI	N/A	N/A	Agree worth acknowledging possibility.	NAI	Acknowledges possibility of e!Thaidakar
One	24	Archer	Says they didn't mean JNV but meant JungleFiend	N/A	N/A	Verifiable	NAI	None
One	25	Stick	Quotes aArcher, notes their role claim. Also claims to have been bombarding TJ with questions, and to have recieved PAFOs in response.	N/A	N/A	Also, therefore, claiming a role. Question whether gained any information more widely useful from questions. If claiming early possession of role, then potential target regardless - value in claiming specifics of role? Unless knows game role madness (TMI?) and therefore feels safe claiming?	Mild evil	Questions Archer
One	26	TJ	Clarifies meme	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	27	Szeth Pancakes	Explicit poke vote on StrikerEZ	StrikerEZ	N/A	None	NAI	Poke votes on StrikerEZ
One	28	Matrim's Dice	Has asked GM question that wasn't PAFO'd.	N/A	N/A	What was question about?	NAI	None
One	29	Kasimir	Expresses incredulity at questions being asked	N/A	N/A	Attempting to suggest no role?	NAI	None
One	30	Ashbringer	Comments on Fog/Frog confusion	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	31	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Responds to Archer, says they said they didn't want to kill Dannnex when voting on them because Dannnex said the same to them	N/A	N/A	Feels genuine, mistaken about who voted on them	Mild village	None
One	32	Stick	Says asking questions knowing they'll receive PAFOs, asking anyway	N/A	N/A	Reinforcing roleclaim?	Unsure	None
One	33	TJ	Comments on title confusion	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	34	Devotary	RP, votes on Ashbringer for RP reasons	Ashbringer	N/A	Reasonable poke vote target	NAI	Poke/RP vote on Ashbringer
One	35	Kasimir	Makes comments on title puns	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	36	Tani	Questions TJ about his meme	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	37	Dannnex	Tells Thaidakar it was Matrim's Dice who voted on them	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	38	Matrim's Dice	Corrects Thaidakar about having voted on them. Suggests Szeth's poke vote might be a Szeth elim tell, but could just be normal behaviour	N/A	N/A	Gut dislike of equivocation on Szeth	Very mild evil	None
One	39	Kasimir	Quotes Matrim's Dice about Szeth, retracts on Devotary, votes on Matrim.	Matrim's Dice	Devotary	If vote is from quote, understandable	Very mild good	Votes on Matrim's Dice
One	40	Illwei	Doesn't believe Thaidakar e/e with Dannnex or Matrim's Dice. Thinks Matrim probably village for not voting on Szeth	N/A	N/A	I disliked the equivocation on Szeth, but can see how it could be seen as uncertain villager. Agree re Thaidakar. Attempt to solve game	Mild good	Matrim more likely village
One	41	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Apologises for getting Matrim and Dannnex confused, says their head exploded from amount they're keeping track of	N/A	N/A	Not sure too much to keep track of at this point?	Mild evil	None
One	42	Matrim's Dice	RP. Replies to Kasimir about a "shuffle squat"	N/A	N/A	Unsure what they're referring to	NAI	None
One	43	Kasimir	Questions Matrim about his Szeth equivocation	N/A	N/A	Agree worth probing	Unsure	Interrogating Matrim
One	44	Archer	Quotes Devotary's RP, asks them whether they're claiming not to be an epic. Says Matrim's take is interesting	N/A	N/A	Reinforces claim to be an Epic. Question why insistent on role claiming	Unsure	None
One	45	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Votes on Archer	Archer	Dannnex	Archer definitely up to something, unsure whether villager gambit or elim. Absence of justification makes me suspect less likely elim jumping on this	Moderate village	Votes on Archer
One	46	Matrim's Dice	Meant that they thought Szeth's poke vote was just something Szeth does. Asks Thaidakar why they voted on Archer	N/A	N/A	Unclear therefore why they posted it	Mild evil	None
One	47	Devotary	Responds to Archer, says that Reckoners are famously not Epics.	N/A	N/A	Not a village aligned Epic, isn't aware of them	Very marginally more likely evil	None
One	48	Tani	Votes on TJ	TJ	N/A	Not useful	NAI	None
One	49	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Says vote on Archer due to gut	N/A	N/A	Feels good from new player - I think an elim more likely to justify themselves	Mild village	None
One	50	Araris	RP. Suggests Thaidakar be responsible with vote placing. Assists Kas with "shuffle thing" votes on Mat	Matrim's Dice	N/A	Equally, voting gives more information to consider. What is meant by shuffle thing?	Unsure	Votes on Matrim's Dice
One	51	Stick	Votes on Tani, makes joke about them wanting a train on TJ	Tani	N/A	Not a serious vote	NAI	Joke vote on Tani
One	52	Experience	Asks whether Archer has an Epic role they want to tell us about	N/A	N/A	Archer has been hinting at a role - worth questioning it. Think questioning it is NAI. Also unaware of village aligned Epics - marginally more likely to be evil	NAI	Questions Archer
One	53	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Reacts to Araris with alarm, says did not realise vote is tool meant to kill someone	N/A	N/A	Respectfully, fairly basic part of game that vote to lynch. Feels like performative overreaction	Moderate evil	None
One	54	Matrim's Dice	Replies to Araris, suggests voting also a tool to gauge reactions to being voted on, takes Thaidakar's misunderstanding at face value. Says only they and Kas can shuffle.	N/A	N/A	Agree re voting as tool for information	NAI	None
One	55	Ashbringer	Points out that Matrim has three votes on them	N/A	N/A	Themself included as a poke vote. Why leaving vote on given build up of votes?	Unsure. Not sure Matrim feels under pressure, why leave vote on?	None
One	56	Araris	Says they can also shuffle with Kas. Asks Ashbringer who the third vote is	N/A	N/A	Keep the flirting out of thread, gentlemen.	NAI	None
One	57	Ashbringer	Says they were first vote on Matrim	N/A	N/A	Continued absence of justification for prolonged poke vote	Very mild evil	None
One	58	Stick	Says they were ninja'd by Araris, and missed Ashbringer's vote	N/A	N/A	Fair enough	NAI	None
One	59	Araris	Suggests thread should put more votes on other players	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	60	Experience	Votes on Araris	Araris	N/A	Feels like vote purely responsive	NAI	None
One	61	Matrim's Dice	Says they've been the leading train two hours into in D1 six times, has been lynched D1 once	N/A	N/A	Feels unconcerned by pressure, think NAI - vote lead two hours into D1 unlikely to hold as they point out	NAI	None
One	62	Araris	Insists on being voted on, isn't often voted out D1, is in LG	N/A	N/A	Nonchalance about being voted out	Probably NAI	None
One	63	Stick	Wary of Experience and Thaidakar, attributes it to gut	N/A	N/A	Agree re both	Mild village	Wary of Thaidakar and Experience
One	64	Experience	Offers Stick a cookie to assuage their gut	N/A	N/A	Not worried about it	Very mild village	None
One	65	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Is also beginning to think Experience is suspicious	N/A	N/A	Agree, want to see reasoning. Reactive to Stick's suspicion?	Mild evil	Suspicious of Experience
One	66	Ashbringer	Asks whether people mind mind games.	N/A	N/A	Point of asking?	Unsure	None
One	67	Experience	RP	N/A	N/A	NAI	NAI	None
One	68	Matrim's Dice	Gut village of Stick, Ashbringer, TJ. Null on Thaidakar and Araris, thinks Kas and Experience feel normal, but that that's not necessarily village, might be in Kas' case	N/A	N/A	Would question gut takes, now seen Matrim's alignment.	Known non-village	See post
One	69	Experience	Notes Matrim included GM in village reads	N/A	N/A	NAI	NAI	None
One	70	Araris	Matrim putting GM in village reads makes them want to leave their vote on them	N/A	N/A	Not sure I see it as anything more than a joke	Very mild evil	None
One	71	Ashbringer	Says hello to Striker	N/A	N/A	Presume Striker was viewing the thread	NAI	None
One	72	Striker	RP. Votes on Matrim's Dice as one of the times they vote on them early in D1 exe has to be right. Has bad gut read on them. Says will disappear for a while after post. Asks for vote count	Matrim's Dice	N/A	Obviously (and probably deliberately) poor logic for vote on Matrim's Dice. Why ask for vote count if disappearing?	Gut mild evil	Votes on Matrim's Dice
One	73	Tani	"VC: Numbers"	N/A	N/A	Joke	NAI	None
One	74	TUA	RP. Says they should add game comments, but don't have any. Might just RP and chill	N/A	N/A	If not going to make comments, not contributing as village, impossible to solve. Should policy lynch at appropriate point	Functionally not village	None
One	75	Matrim's Dice	Says they're aware that TJ is the GM, and putting them as village was taking an active stance against people voting for him. Points out that Striker's logic on voting for him based on past games is flawed. Says amazing that can get village read in one game and elim read in another without changing playstyle. Says Striker objectively wrong to claim they're not talking to anyone	N/A	N/A	Unlikely that eliminators woudl actively seek to change their playstyle. Feels slightly performative, moot point, known non village. Think Striker's point was RP only?	Known non-village	None
One	76	Illwei	Thinks Experience and Araris village. Thinks Thaidakar not e/e with Matrim, Dannnex, or Stick, Experience not e/e with Araris or Archer, Ashbringer not e/e with Striker. Leaning village on Ashbringer for poking Striker when Striker was viewing the thread, thinks NAI in reality. Suspicious of Kasimir for attempt to appear normal	N/A	N/A	Would like to see justifications for team exclusions. Need to check notes, agree with at least some, but would be helpful to have called out what they're reliant on. Like being clear with reads.	Mild village	See post
One	77	Archer	Says they are an epic, wants to figure out if everyone is an Epic. Claims their role is that they can ask dead people questions if their alignment hasn't been confirmed. Asks if anyone is not an epic	N/A	N/A	Bold to assume everyone an Epic from their own role. Unsure where additional information from. If role true, feels more likely village aligned than elim aligned. Odd role to make up, easily verifiable.	Don't think an eliminator would know immediately that village aligned epics exist pre-D1 lynch. Moderately hard clear village?	Sceptical of Devotary
One	78	Illwei	Tells people not to answer Archer asking if anyone isn't an Epic	N/A	N/A	Agree generally with wisdom of not roleclaiming, dislike Illwei asserting it as wisdom - both useful to see who makes claims, and potentially claiming cred for saying village-like things	Mild evil	None
One	79	TUA	Claims to be a regular	N/A	N/A	Don't think AI. Could be villager seeking to make themselves less of a target (not sure villagers actually should do so), or elim seeking to avoid havign to explain actions down the road	NAI	None
One	80	Archer	Votes on Illwei, as thinks they have said previously that secrecy of blackout distributions favours eliminators.	Illwei	Kasimir	Actions consistent with stated beliefs. Feels genuine.	Moderate village	Votes on Illwei
One	81	STINK	Asks whether it's worth them reading the last four pages	N/A	N/A	Always, but not inconsistent with historic playstyle	NAI	None
One	82	Matrim's Dice	Doesn't know how Archer could confirm no vanilla roles without access to the player list.	N/A	N/A	Known non-village	Known non-village	None
One	83	Striker	Responds to Matrim, says not talking to anyone was RP reason for vote. Retracts from Matrim, votes on Stink	STINK	Matrim's Dice	Why retract vote? One substantive Matrim post in interim - what in it made them retract? Stink being consistent - easy vote?	Mild evil	Votes on Stink
One	84	Matrim's Dice	Acknowledges Striker's RP	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	85	STINK	Quotes Striker's vote, "Truly great to be back"	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	86	Devotary	Replies to Archer, says it is their RP character who isn't an Epic. Says bold move for Archer to claim Epic in game where elim team are corrupted Epics	N/A	N/A	Actively isn't claiming vanilla. Not sure Epic claim if elims listed as corrupted Epics is so bold - question what Devotary meant by this.	Gut moderate evil	Sus of Archer?
One	87	Experience	Elims being "corrupted" epics leads them to think there are some villager epics	N/A	N/A	Very fair assumption. Reassess alignment indicativeness of Archer claim. Read rules in greater depth myself next game.	NAI	None
One	88	Matrim's Dice	Elims being corrupted epics not just epics, villagers being Reckoner Allies not Reckoners implies village epics, ninja'd by Experience	N/A	N/A	Very fair assumption. Reassess alignment indicativeness of Archer claim. Read rules in greater depth myself next game.	Known non-village	None
One	89	Striker	Trivial reply to STINK	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	90	TUA	Is claiming regular	N/A	N/A	None new	NAI	None
One	91	Devotary	Expects a higher percentage of epics than regulars to be eliminators. Non-epics on corrupted epics team would be funny	N/A	N/A	Possibly, but more villagers than elims, so epic not necessarily more likely to be elim than village. Don't think it justifies assessment of Archer's claim as bold	Mild evil	None
One	92	Stick	Expresses incredulity at Archer's claim, suggests they might be setting themself up for the night kill. Says we shouldn't be mass claiming	N/A	N/A	Gut read as performative	Mild evil	None
One	93	Ashbringer	Says we need Elims to claim Reckoners, or what Devotary said	N/A	N/A	Not quite sure I follow	Unsure	None
One	94	Archer	Isn't sure whether Devotary elim or vanilla villager. Thinks some level of claiming necessary in blackout gain to understand the game. Had initially assumed everyone was an Epic, thinks TUA's defence of Devotary so indirect it felt genuine.	N/A	N/A	Agree re interrogation of Devotary. Why assume everyone an Epic based on their own role - feels odd. But again, odder to assume as an eliminator.	Mild village	Suspicious of Devotary
One	95	Illwei	Blackout of all information favours eliminators, but this does not mean total openness favours village. Village claims narrow NK possibilities for eliminators. Will treat further elim claims as elim.	N/A	N/A	Very odd to say vanilla claims will be read as evil. Feels llike threat to make people not claim, as not reliable alignment-discerning tool, which Illwei must know. Plausible to want to dissuade village claims regardless of alignment	Mild evil from coercion	None
One	96	TJ	Vote count	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	97	Ashbringer	Says we should be cautious nitpicking GM PMs, and thinks doing so might be against the rules	N/A	N/A	Not sure spirit of the rules precludes questioning GM in blackout game, if so, poorly written rule.	NAI	None
One	98	TUA	Says they may have stepped over the line of not nitpicking GM PMs	N/A	N/A	Not sure they did	NAI	None
One	99	STINK	Thought game would have PMs	N/A	N/A	Indirectly implying no doc to chat in? Plausibly performative	Unsure	None
One	100	Matrim's Dice	Asks whether there are neutral roles, as factions section of rules is definitive. Doesn't see a reason not to vote for Dannnex, votes for them	Dannnex	Thaidakar	Why would GM give clarity in blackout game. Known non-village, suggests thought of themselves as neutral	Known non-village	None
One	101	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Asks how much RP this game involves, and whether they should RP	N/A	N/A	Can read thread and see not everyone RPing - performative? Unsure	Unsure	None
One	102	Matrim's Dice	Tells Thaidakar that RP is optional, encourages them to introduce their character	N/A	N/A	NAI	Known non-village	None
One	103	Archer	Asks Stink if they would like a PM from a PM person. Thinks Matrim worded joke about GM to avoid suggesting being in the elim doc. Raises the question of what TJ did that makes this game blackout. Tells Thaidakar to RP if they want to, and that it normally makes up less than 20% of posted content	N/A	N/A	Claiming PM ability? Query what they meant here. Not sure I buy wording point - feels overly uncharitable explanation. Tunnelling villager? Consider elim seeking to cement D1 safe lynch	Gut mild village	Tunnelling on Matrim's Dice
One	104	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Thanks Archer for RP advice, says they will get better at game as they understand it more	N/A	N/A	Trying to read charitably, remain concerned that overdoing being a new player	Mild evil	None
One	105	Illwei	Thinks Experience, Araris and Archer are village. Thinks Stick is an elim. Believes Thaidakar isn't teamed with Mat, Dannnex or Stick, Exprerience isn't e/e with Araris or Archer, and Ashbringer not e/e with Striker. Thinks Ashbringer village for prodding Striker whilst they were viewing thread. Suspicious of Kas for trying to seem normal. Thinks Stick is an elim because interacting but not providing thoughts Thinks Archer's point on Matrim comes from a village perspective. Says you can't read into Stink wanting PMs, but if STINK is evil wonders about number of elims had checked in by then	N/A	N/A	Read Illwei as village. Agree with much of thought process re Archer, like the exclusionary connections	Moderate village	See post
One	106	Thaidakar the Ghostblood	Asks what an elim is	N/A	N/A	Very much feels over-playign being new. Elims is a very natural shortening for Eliminators, with plenty of context, and Eliminators as evil players is very clear at top of rules doc, which they say they read. New/inexperienced does not mean has no reading comprehension	Strong evil. Don't like lynching new players early, but shouldn't give them a free pass either	None
One	107	Dannnex	Tells Thaidakar what an eliminator is	N/A	N/A	Less likely e/e with Thaidakar	NAI	Less likely e/e with Thaidakar
One	108	STINK	Reiterates what RP is, says they'd welcome a PM, jokes about structure of Illwei's post	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	109	Matrim's Dice	Replies to Archer's suggestion they deliberately worded post to avoid mentioning elim doc. Doesn't think liek that when elim, thinks more likely to reword as village to avoid seeming like elim. Doesn't think there has to be something that makes it mandatory that it's blackout, though there probably is	N/A	N/A	Dislike point about self meta. Feels too defensive when point made is spurious anyway	Mild evil	None
One	110	Illwei	Retracts on Dannnex, votes on Stick	Stick	Dannnex	Consistent with prior post	NAI	Votes on Stick
One	111	Szeth Pancakes	Going to be low activity because of life	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	112	Archer	RP	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	113	Experience	Asks people to PM them if they can. No new thoughts, wants to review Illwei if Stick or Dannnex flip elim	N/A	N/A	Trying to imply Illwei/Dannnex team? Knowledge that one of Stick/Dannex evil?	Very mild evil	None
One	114	Illwei	Asks Experience why they think Illwei would vote for teammates off the bat D1	N/A	N/A	Distancing, but fair point to raise - is an odd singular thought to have	Very mild good	None
One	115	Experience	Doesn't think Illwei is voting for teammates, but was making a mental note based off a gut feeling	N/A	N/A	Was making an explicit, not a mental note.	Very mild evil	None
One	116	Matrim's Dice	Reading Experience as solidly village. Disagrees with Illwei about Stick being elim	N/A	N/A	Gut dislike post	Unsure	Reads Experience village, Stick not elim
One	117	Illwei	Asks Mat why they think Experience is solidly village	N/A	N/A	Question worth asking	Mild good	None
One	118	Tani	Claims to be Epic called ricochet. Asks whether red highlit roles can be villagers	N/A	N/A	Not first Epic claim, elim team now aware of villae epics. Think question about red likely misinterpretation. Question why making claim	Unsure, gut village	None
One	119	Matrim's Dice	Says thinks Experience village because of their type of post - suggests when they're an elim they avoid posting random takes and do less fluff, thinks e!Experience might be more reserved	N/A	N/A	Gut strong dislike of bringing up own elim meta	Moderate evil	Thinks Experience village
One	120	JNV	RP, is suspicious of Thaidakar for being too clueless. Doesn't remember being that confused when new, but thinks it could happen so won't vote for them	N/A	N/A	Agree strongly, not e/e with Thaidakar	Moderate village	Not e/e with Thaidakar, thinks Thaidakar acting too confused
One	121	Experience	Is cglad to be acting like v!Mat	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	122	Matrim's Dice	Thought Thaidakar just didn't read the rules. Agrees you should probably know what an elim is after reading main intro page, thinks that leans into territory of assuming how someone learns.	N/A	N/A	Agree that being charitable important, think not knowing what elim is is going too far. New does not equal unintelligent. If evil, look much more heavily at Thaidakar	Mild-moderate evil	Defending Thaidakar
One	123	Tani	RPs as Ricochet	N/A	N/A	Is ricochet just RP character or is it a roleclaim?	Unsure	None
One	124	Kasimir	Thinks Devotary's comment on taking out epics on principle is RP reason, comments on Archer pushing on it. Thinsk Devotary/Archer exchange is odd. Thinks Experience asking Archer whether they have an Epic roles comes from village perspective that Epics = bad. Has negative gut read of Thaidakar because feels like they're playing things up. Is suspicious of Araris for inviting D1 votes. Thinks Thaidakar's suspicions of Experience feel like sheeping. Dislikes Archer's claim, but thinks it is in character for them. Is interested that Illwei defensive about voting for teammates D1 - says they did so LG78 and LG74. Votes Karnatheon because they were viewing thread	Karnatheon	N/A	Agree re negative gut read of Thaidakar. Disagree with reads of Experience and Illwei. Gut dislike of tone which I can't put my finger on.	Gut mild evil	Negative gut read of Thaidakar, defence of Devotary, Experience, sus of Illwei?
One	125	Experience	Isn't complaining about being village read by Matrim	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	126	Elandera	IM reminder	IM	IM	IM	IM	IM
One	127	Araris	Thinks Matrim's reads list felt insincere	N/A	N/A	Fair enough	Mild village	None
One	128	Kasimir	Has bad gut read on Araris and Thaidakar, won't push Araris on their gut whilst sticking to their own	N/A	N/A	Is read on Thaidakar gut? Or downplaying it having called it out as distancing?	Very mild evil	Bad gut read of Araris and Thaidakar
One	129	Devotary	Thinks all corrupted epics will be epics, therefore the elim epic/villager epic ratio much higher than elim regular/village regular ratio. Won't clear anyone for not being an Epic, but can't see corrupted epics not having epics	N/A	N/A	Walking back claim within same post as suggesting elims have no regulars.	Moderate evil	None
One	130	Illwei	Says question about voting D1 was specifically to Experience, who was on team with them when they bussed D1. Thinks it was an odd thing for Experience to say. Thinks people commenting on epics being bad is an elim slip from not realising epics aren't just evil	N/A	N/A	Fair enough re Experience. Had same thought process on epics = bad - whilst I'm not sure it is an elim slip necessarily, think thought process of Illwei's comes from villager.	Moderate village	None
One	131	Striker	Retracts from Stink, votes on Illwei	Illwei	STINK	No justification, think Illwei's points have made sense - why the vote?	Mild evil	Votes on Illwei
One	132	Matrim's Dice	Asks Kas whether they think Devotary/Archer exhancge is e/e. Says that Kas' point re Thaidakar was one made by JNV, which they agreed with. Liked how Stick was interacting with thread. Doubts they'll seriously elim read Kas because they're just too villagery. Thinks Striker is village	N/A	N/A	Dislike strongly the village read on Kas. e/e? Reason for thinkign Striker village?	Mild evil	Reads Kas and Striker as village
One	133	Striker	Says they're indeed a villager	N/A	N/A	Joke, NAI	NAI	None
One	134	Ashbringer	Idea about alignments lying to us got stuck in head with Archer's claim. Wonders whether villagers all epics, elims all not. Says would fall apart upon claiming.	N/A	N/A	Think very heavily overthinking	Unsure	None
One	135	Araris	Thinks village roles all differing from elim roles does not necessarily entail game being solvable	N/A	N/A	Fair point, particularly in backout with no roles confirmed to exist	NAI	None
One	136	Szeth Pancakes	Retracts from Striker quoting their post	N/A	Striker	Why retract on basis of that post?	Unsure	None
One	137	Experience	Responds to Illwei, thinks they might have D1 voted teammates becuase they did that in game Experience and Illwei were e/e	N/A	N/A	Gut read that post feels slightly off	Gut mild evil	None
One	138	Amanuensis	RP. Vote count, votes on Matrim's Dice	Matrim's Dice	N/A	Unexplained, puts Matrim ahead of Archer	Unsure	Votes on Matrim's Dice, breaking tie with Archer
One	139	Karnatheon	Votes on Archer for claiming Epic, says whether irs alignment indicative or not would get information in blackout situation. Asks Tani whether they're also claiming an Epic or whether they were establishing RP character	Archer	N/A	Very strongly dislike vote. Particularly with Archer's claimed role, information motivated vote does not feel justified	Moderate evil	Votes on Archer
One	140	TJ	Corrects Amanuensis' vote count	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	141	Kasimir	Replies to Devotary. Thinks even if all elims are epics, the monent we discard assumption that all villagers non-epic, we are committed to significant, non-zero number of village epics. Can see Illwei's point re Experience. Asks Striker to explain their vote on Illwei. HAs no opinion on whether Archer/Devotary exchange is e/e. Thinks reading Devotary's claim as RP is natural read of it. Thinks Thaidakar's voting inconsistent with amount of newness they claim. Stick hasn't popped out to them. Returns to village epic debate. If Archer's claim plausible, and plausible that Archer not evil, then committed to not being able to draw epic/non-Epic line in terms of roles/alignments. Finds idea intuitively compelling. Finds it too strong to assume all epics are evil, wants to know base rate of epic occurrence to make claims about whether a given Epic is more likely to be village or not. Thinks Devo/Archer/Illwei discussion, however, is hinged on wgat elims would perceive the safe thing to say is - would a villager be more likely to think that Epics are likely to be evil? Think if elims have regulars, less likely to worry about suggesting village epics. If elim team all epics, reasinable for them to be cautious about claiming village epics. Thinks elims would want to stay away from Epic claims, suggests Devotary agrees. Notes category of players who believe people who claim epics are evil are sus, puts Illwei and Archer in this category, suggests Matrim's Dice and Experience both also push back against this idea. Thinks Experience, Karnatheon, and possibly TUA believe epics are evil. Asks Ashbringer and Amanuensis their views. Has negative read on Experience for pushing Archer on their Epic claim whilst pushign back on the idea that epics are evil. Negative on Thaidakar for overly claiming newness. Negative gut on Araris. Cricket meme(?) on Archer. Positive on Devotary, rethinking. Light positive on Aman and Illwei	N/A	N/A	If of the view that elims would want to stay away from epic claims, committed to Archer not being elim? Suggests that it is not intuitive that epics can be good. Large amount of time spent considering this. Think view on Archer inconistent with positions stated in this post	Mild/moderate evil	See post
One	142	Ashbringer	Thinks Archer's claim is bold for a lie, but that it's a long shot to bluff. Says theyd be group A (believes elims would want to stay far away from epic claims or view that epics can be good) but says epics may be good but may be not. Says Archer is on thin ice.	N/A	N/A	Feels like miunderstood group A (or maybe I have) but to suggest claim is bold for a lie and then that Archer is on thin ice feels inconsistent	Mild evil	Thinsk Archer is on thin ice
One	143	Kasimir	Memes	N/A	N/A	None	NAI	None
One	144	Amanuensis	Believes Archer is a village epic, not necessarily their role details. Also believes TUA is a regular villager	N/A	N/A	Agreed on both	Mild village	Believes Archer and TUA are village
One	145	Kasimir	Says gut read on Aman due to similarities with MR38 playstyle. Thinsk unease of Araris because he's giving LG78/MR52 vibes	N/A	N/A	Recall Kas saying in AG8 they had difficulty reading Araris - interesting to find they now feel more confident	Unsure	None
One	146	TJ	Off topic	GM	GM	GM	GM	GM
One	147	Amanuensis	Mat has stood out to them, is preferred lynch, would be cool with Dannnex lynch	N/A	N/A	Would like to see reasons	Unsure	Wants to lynch Matrim's Dice, content to lynch Dannnex
One	148	Kasimir	Asks Aman for reasoning of their reads	N/A	N/A	NAI	NAI	None
One	149	Stick	If Archer is village, elims are considering his claim, so we should too. Doesn't think v!Archer would be lying. Doesn't think e!Archer would truthfully make claim of what role entails. Thinks Archer likely village. Suggests Archer might be neutral. Questions whether Thaidakar playing newbie card. Thinks something off about Experience asking players to PM them. Thinks Kas wrong to say that Experience believing epics = elims = bad comes from village perspective - thinks more likely to come from elim. Gut reads Illwei as village. Wants to give Thaidakar the benefit of the doubt but sus. Votes for Experience	Experience	Tani	Would like to see suspicion of Experience made more explicit, believe it is due to PM post and their view that epics = elims? Check if view consistently applied. Archer neutrality to reduce value of consensus cleared villager?	Unsure	Votes on Experience, village reads Archer

Summary:

Consistent village read on Illwei, firmly believe Archer's claim much more likely to come from a villager.

Gut worry about Kas, supported by concern about their inconsistency on Archer. I recall seeing on a skim of the thread that Kas later claims Village Epic, but misread his PM. I haven't got to this yet, but express a degree of incredulity about this claim.

Firmly agree with much of the suspicion raised about Thaidakar.