What Void?

[Serack he/him]

Is the “void” in “voidbringers” and “voidlight” just a fantastical stand in term for the “bad” or “hell” or something or is there actually a property of the “enemy” that makes the meaning of the term “void” particularly applicable?

 

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void
 adjective

\ ˈvȯid   \

Definition of void

 (Entry 1 of 3)

1a: of no legal force or effect : NULLa void contract

b: VOIDABLE

2: containing nothingvoid space

3a: not occupied : VACANTa void bishopric

b: not inhabited : DESERTED

4: IDLE, LEISURE

5a: being without something specified : DEVOIDa nature void of all malice

b: having no members or examplesspecifically,  of a suit : having no cards represented in a particular hand

6: VAIN, USELESS

void

 noun

Definition of void (Entry 2 of 3)

1a: OPENING, GAP

b: empty space : EMPTINESS, VACUUM

2: the quality or state of being without something : LACK, ABSENCE

3: a feeling of want or hollowness

4: absence of cards of a particular suit in a hand originally dealt to a player

void

 verb

voided; voiding; voids

Definition of void (Entry 3 of 3)

transitive verb

1: NULLIFY, ANNUL

2a: to make empty or vacant : CLEAR

barchaic : VACATE, LEAVE

3: DISCHARGE, EMIT

intransitive verb

: to eliminate solid or liquid waste from the body

 

 

from Merriam-Webster online

The only in-story property that immediately comes to mind that vaguely makes “void” relevant is the near ultraviolet nature of “voidlight,” making it maybe slightly analogous to an absence, or lack of light.  

My motivation for exploring this is that our expectations on just what “Voidbringers” means have already been violated twice, so maybe another shoe is bound to drop.  Also the loose ties to ultraviolet light are just an unsatisfying reasoning for the term “voidbringer” to me.  So either I’m missing some other, more valid reason for the term that explains what we already understand, it’s just not that important, or we are missing something fundamental that the term reveals about the true threat of the “void.”

 

Some other mysteries that may tie in

1. We still don’t know what was so scary that the old Knights Radiant perpetrated the Recreance
2. We don’t know how the original Ashynites (Particularly Ishtar) ruined their own planet.  Oh, or how they apparently heel-face turned (tvtropes link) and became the forces fighting the Void.
3. More speculatively related, we don’t know what was rocking the original 16+ that they thought killing Aldonasium was the best option to deal with it.  

I bring that last up because I suspect the Dawnshards were related to all 3, and it makes the question possibly even broader.  

We have been contentedly identifying the “void” with Odium, and his not entirely understood motivations, but there may be a more significant big bad that’s been hiding right under our noses in the term “Void”

Edited October 25, 2022 by Serack

[LinuxSBC]

Odium is referred to as the Void because of that "let me take your pain" thing. He's the void of emotion, and his closest followers give him their emotions.

Also, for mystery #1, we do. It's the fact that humans are the invaders, not the defenders. They believed that they would best fulfil their oaths by either supporting the singers or giving up their powers, and they chose the latter option (except the Skybreakers, who chose the former).

[Serack he/him]

28 minutes ago, LinuxSBC said:

Odium is referred to as the Void because of that "let me take your pain" thing. He's the void of emotion, and his closest followers give him their emotions.

This occurred to me after I finished writing.  Although I don’t consider it invalid, there is only one follower of Odium that this appears to have really happened to, whereas all the other “voidbringers” are quite passionate.

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Also, for mystery #1, we do. It's the fact that humans are the invaders, not the defenders. They believed that they would best fulfil their oaths by either supporting the singers or giving up their powers, and they chose the latter option (except the Skybreakers, who chose the former).

We were told otherwise in text. The below quote is of the Stormfather from page 1138 of Oathbringer, and it pretty explicitly states that there is another, world shattering reveal yet to come.

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The Almighty kept this from his Radiants,” Dalinar said. “When they discovered it, they abandoned their vows.”
It is more than that. My memory of all this is … strange. First, I was not fully awake; I was but the spren of a storm. Then I was like a child. Changed and shaped during the frantic last days of a dying god.
But I do remember. It was not only the truth of humankind’s origin that caused the Recreance. It was the distinct, powerful fear that they would destroy this world, as men like them had destroyed the one before. The Radiants abandoned their vows for that reason, as will you.

Edit, this is reinforced when Maya testified at Adolin’s trial on RoW

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“This truth, though, means a greater problem is. Thousands of spren chose death instead of letting the Radiants continue. Does this not worry you more? They truly believed that—as humans claimed at the time—Surgebinding would destroy the world. That the solution was to end the orders of Radiants. Suddenly, at the cost of many lives.”
“Did you know the full cost, Maya?” Adolin asked, the question suddenly occurring to him. “Did you and your Radiants know that you would become deadeyes?”
Adolin felt Maya searching deep, pushing through her exhaustion, seeking … memories that were difficult for her to access. Eventually, she shook her head and whispered, “Pain. Yes. Death? No. Maybe.”
Adolin sat beside her, letting her lean against him. “Why, Maya? Why were you willing to do it?”
“To save … save…” She sagged and shook her head.
“To save us from something worse,” Adolin said, then looked to Blended. “What does it mean?”

 

 

Edited October 25, 2022 by Serack

[Spearguy]

I thought it was pretty well established that the thing that destroyed Ashyn was the people their fooling around with surgbinding.

Also Odium tried to get Dalinar to give him his pain.  

[That1Cellist he/him]

The void also applies to the look in their eyes and the death that the Voidbringers brought. This is noted in a couple of books referenced in Jasnah's notes, I believe.

Those other mysteries still stand, and besides speculation, we don't have a ton going for us with any of them. However, we do know that the destruction of Ashyn did have something to do with the surges.

Edited October 25, 2022 by That1Cellist

[Quantus he/him]

57 minutes ago, Serack said:

This occurred to me after I finished writing.  Although I don’t consider it invalid, there is only one follower of Odium that this appears to have really happened to, whereas all the other “voidbringers” are quite passionate.

I can think of at least two: Moash and Amaram (in the throws of Yelig-nar).  There's also the time that Glys said "My sorrow, Renarin. I will give you my sorrow." which has a similar theme and which some have theorized is functionally relevant to actual Voidbinding (as a distinct magic).

Devil's advocate on that is that it might not be anything innate to Odium and instead might have to do with the fact that per Honor's Binding he cannot directly harm people that havent given him permission to do so.  That means it could be more of a result of his Imprisonment in Roshar and not purely the Intent of Odium.  

[Treamayne]

6 hours ago, Serack said:

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Adolin sat beside her, letting her lean against him. “Why, Maya? Why were you willing to do it?”
“To save … save…” She sagged and shook her head.
“To save us from something worse,” Adolin said, then looked to Blended. “What does it mean?” 

 

Keep in mind, we don't really know that was what Maya meant to say - only that Adolin thought that was what she meant

6 hours ago, Spearguy said:

I thought it was pretty well established that the thing that destroyed Ashyn was the people their fooling around with surgbinding.

6 hours ago, That1Cellist said:

The void also applies to the look in their eyes and the death that the Voidbringers brought. This is noted in a couple of books referenced in Jasnah's notes, I believe.

Those other mysteries still stand, and besides speculation, we don't have a ton going for us with any of them. However, we do know that the destruction of Ashyn did have something to do with the surges.

We don't know it was Surgebinding - or, if it was, that is was the same or related to how Surgebinding functions on Roshar. We know that it was a form of investiture, and likely paired with a Dawnshard that increased the scope and range to cause the damage on Ashyn.

Also, it's entirely possible that the "void" of Odium is different for Humans and Singers, since Singers have gemhearts and are connected to the Rhythms. While humans like Moash have an emotionlessness about them, Singers lose normal access to the normal emotional Rhythms of Roshar (which are replaced by Odium's versions) and struggle to access those less-violent emotions without intervention (such as Timbre).