Dalinar's Power

[Lighteyed Lieutenant he/him]

In Oathbringer, when Dalinar opens the perpendicularity and rejects Odium, he says 

Quote

"I am Unity."

Is there any significance to why "Unity" is capitalized? Is this important, or just a proper noun?

[alder24]

8 minutes ago, Lighteyed Lieutenant said:

In Oathbringer, when Dalinar opens the perpendicularity and rejects Odium, he says 

Is there any significance to why "Unity" is capitalized? Is this important, or just a proper noun?

Yes, it's important. We don't know why. Brandon has Rafo every single question about it but Unity, and later the word "Ascend", being capitalized, are important.

Spoiler

TheWeirdTalesPodcast

In Oathbringer, Dalinar says the third ideal of the Bondsmiths:

"I will take responsibility for my actions, and each time I fail, I will rise again a better man."

He then opens a perpendicularity, saving the battle of Thaylen Field for our heroes. Later, Odium is ranting to Taravangian about how Dalinar wasn't supposed to Ascend, with a capital A. 

The question - is Odium's use of the word "Ascend" referring to ascending to the next Ideal of the Bondsmiths, or is there something more going on there?

Brandon Sanderson

I used a capital letter there intentionally, and normal saying of oaths would not get a capital letter.

That is in a character's perspective. There's a character using that capital letter, the character uses that capital letter intentionally.

YouTube Spoiler Stream 5 (Dec. 2, 2022)

 

[Quantus he/him]

The popular theory is that Dalinar is showing the first hints of a path that will lead to him UnShattering (ReForging?  I dont think there's a term yet) the Honor Shard, but where Tanavast interpreted the Shard with a heavy focus on Oaths and Bonds between individuals, Dalinar will see it through a more wholistic Community lens and rebrand it as Unity. 

Not everyone buys into this explanation but Im not aware of a competing theory.  

 

Another corollary theory is that Cultivation has specifically prepared replacement vessels for each of the three Shards in Dalinar, Lift, and MrT.

Edited June 7, 2023 by Quantus

[Lighteyed Lieutenant he/him]

Yes, that would make sense. 

On 6/7/2023 at 3:36 PM, Quantus said:

Another corollary theory is that Cultivation has specifically prepared replacement vessels for each of the three Shards in Dalinar, Lift, and MrT.

Spoiler

In Rhythm of War, when Taravangian kills Rayse and takes the power of Odium, he is also said to have "Ascended."

 

[Quantus he/him]

3 minutes ago, Lighteyed Lieutenant said:

Yes, that would make sense. 

  Hide contents

In Rhythm of War, when Taravangian kills Rayse and takes the power of Odium, he is also said to have "Ascended."

 

Oh, yes He very much did, and that's the accepted Cosmere terms for what happened there.  It's also why Rayse use of the word seemed so significant.  We have three characters that are confirmed to have met with Cultivation directly and not just the Nitchwatcher. One is Mr T and we know what happened there. Another is Dalinar who is Bonded to Tanavast's ghost and is showing all kinds of weird stuff beyond just a Stormfather Bondsmith should be capable of doing.  And we have Lift, who is now blurring realmic lines and is confirmed to be converting calories directly into Cultivation's Lifelight.

[Lighteyed Lieutenant he/him]

Lift is just her own kind of special.

[Spearguy]

There are also a couple of theories that lift is the nightwatcher bondsmith but they seem a little far fetched 

 

[LewsTherinTelescope]

I think he's Ascending to the power in the highstorm, and does so every time he seizes control of it. Bondsmith oaths are centered on unity, and Wyndle implies the spren are the Words, meaning the Stormfather's nature would inherently be about unity. Plus, look at the line before it:

Quote

Dalinar opened his eyes, and knew what the parshwoman saw in him. Swirling clouds, glowing light, thunder and lightning.

“I am Unity.”

And in Rhythm of War, we learn that when Dalinar speaks while riding the storm he speaks it aloud like normal visions but when he speaks as the storm he doesn't, almost as if he's no longer acting through his body in those moments.

Edited June 11, 2023 by LewsTherinTelescope

[The Stormfather He/Him]

I think what it meant when it said Ascend with a capital A was that Odium was trying to get Dalinat to ascend to the fused, as he later implies in RoW is possible, but dalinar stopped that when he started yelling and then swore the ideal.

For Unity, I think it meant that, as lift is partially in the cognitive realm, Dalinar and the Stormfather and partialling in all three. 

Also, another random theory, there are three main shallan personas. Is each one associated with a realm?

for cognitive seems like veil, and in the physical realm she is shallan, so does that mean that radiant is associated with the spiritual realm? if so could she do things differently that a regualr lightweaver, as we see dalinar doing things differently than a regular bondsmith, and with my theory he is partially in the spiritual realm.

[Duxredux he/him]

One hypothesis I've seen is that when Dalinar acts in conjunction with the Stormfather they are in a similar weight/power class as a full Shard. In SH, Ruin notes that for a Shard to have any real power they must have ties to all three Realms - something that Dalinar provides to the Stormfather who holds the bulk of the power. When Dalinar and the Stormfather act, they must do so in accordance with Dalinar's Oath to Unite instead of divide and might rightly be called "Unity". Dalinar doesn't Ascend in the sense that he vaporizes as he isn't channeling the bulk of the power, but the Bondsmith bonded to the remnants of Tanavast's soul was enough to make Rayse run out of town.

[Letryx13]

20 hours ago, Duxredux said:

One hypothesis I've seen is that when Dalinar acts in conjunction with the Stormfather they are in a similar weight/power class as a full Shard. In SH, Ruin notes that for a Shard to have any real power they must have ties to all three Realms - something that Dalinar provides to the Stormfather who holds the bulk of the power. When Dalinar and the Stormfather act, they must do so in accordance with Dalinar's Oath to Unite instead of divide and might rightly be called "Unity". Dalinar doesn't Ascend in the sense that he vaporizes as he isn't channeling the bulk of the power, but the Bondsmith bonded to the remnants of Tanavast's soul was enough to make Rayse run out of town.

I know a lot of people think that Odium was scared off by Tanavast's remnants or something similar when Dalinar said his third ideal, but I have two problems with it.  First, multiple characters have emphasized how dead Tanavast is.  The StormFather, Rabonial, Kelek, and I think Odium himself even does at one point.  And second, the way Odium reacted when Dalinar spoke his ideal, "No, we killed you! We killed you!" makes me think that he's seeing something other than Tanavast.  Yes, it's someone/something he expected to be dead, but it sounds like he was seeing someone/something that more than one person played a role in killing. While we don't know exactly how Odium killed Honor, there's nothing to suggest that Odium had help.  Sure, he could be referring to his forces, but Rayse was the kind of narcissist that wouldn't give people that kind of credit.

It's a little off the wall, but I think Odium could see more clearly into the spiritual realm, something Ishar later supports, when Dalinar spoke his third ideal.  And I think he saw that Adonalsium wasn't dead after all.  That the "we" Odium was referring to were the original sixteen and Hoid.  A little nuts, perhaps, but that's my theory.

 

[alder24]

1 hour ago, Letryx13 said:

Yes, it's someone/something he expected to be dead, but it sounds like he was seeing someone/something that more than one person played a role in killing. While we don't know exactly how Odium killed Honor, there's nothing to suggest that Odium had help.

Well, there is. Odium wasn't just fighting against Honor himself, but both him and Cultivation at the same time. Unless Cultivation teamed up with Odium, which is very very unlikely, it's possible that Odium got some outside help in killing Honor. But this isn't strong evidence.

Spoiler

Seonid

If Cultivation and Honor were romantically involved, why did Cultivation not help Honor against Odium?

Brandon Sanderson

She did.

Idaho Falls Signing (Nov. 28, 2015)

 

Spoiler

Khyrindor

Odium seems to have a bad track record when it comes to killing Shards. He was wounded versus Ambition, and he's trapped on Roshar. Yet, he's credited in killing Devotion and Dominion. My question is: was Autonomy significantly involved and would Odium have been able to do it on his own and still be okay to--

Brandon Sanderson

RAFO. It is dangerous to attack a Shard with one Shard. Let's say that. And a wise Shard would try to avoid that confrontation unless there are specific reasons they think they would have an advantage.

Skyward Seattle signing (Nov. 10, 2018)

 

[ΨιτιsτηεΒέsτ Male]

On 6/7/2023 at 0:13 PM, Lighteyed Lieutenant said:

In Oathbringer, when Dalinar opens the perpendicularity and rejects Odium, he says 

Quote

"I am Unity."

Is there any significance to why "Unity" is capitalized? Is this important, or just a proper noun?

I’d say that throughout the books, we see-  that when he is building worlds, he uses common English words to mean things that are unique in that world. An example of this is the use of “Breaths” in Warbreaker, or “lashing” in stormlight. When he does this, he often capitalizes the words so that they stand out from their normal usage. To me, it seems like something similar is being portrayed as Unity is capitalized. I don’t know what it could be; it could be a power like “lashing” is or some sort of position or something. But I would assume it is not normal usage.

[Letryx13]

4 hours ago, alder24 said:

Well, there is. Odium wasn't just fighting against Honor himself, but both him and Cultivation at the same time. Unless Cultivation teamed up with Odium, which is very very unlikely, it's possible that Odium got some outside help in killing Honor. But this isn't strong evidence.

  Reveal hidden contents

Seonid

If Cultivation and Honor were romantically involved, why did Cultivation not help Honor against Odium?

Brandon Sanderson

She did.

Idaho Falls Signing (Nov. 28, 2015)

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Khyrindor

Odium seems to have a bad track record when it comes to killing Shards. He was wounded versus Ambition, and he's trapped on Roshar. Yet, he's credited in killing Devotion and Dominion. My question is: was Autonomy significantly involved and would Odium have been able to do it on his own and still be okay to--

Brandon Sanderson

RAFO. It is dangerous to attack a Shard with one Shard. Let's say that. And a wise Shard would try to avoid that confrontation unless there are specific reasons they think they would have an advantage.

Skyward Seattle signing (Nov. 10, 2018)

 

I agree that Cultivation siding with Odium makes no sense, and I admit the numbers advantage is suggestive.  But so far, there's been nothing mentioning any of the other shards ever being anywhere near Roshar.  The three moons over the planet are supposed to be a reference to the three gods, from what I understand.  And while it's true that Cultivation helped Honor against Odium, the biggest thing we know of is that her power combined with Honor's to trap Odium.  At least, according to the Storm Father.  But there wasn't much mention of her being involved in the desolations, since most of the humans on Roshar don't know about her.  Dalinar wasn't even aware there was a third god until Odium mentioned her.  So I don't think she played much of a role in the desolations after things got started.

Sure, Autonomy or a different shard could have helped Odium in a deal with him for one reason or another.  But there's been no mention of that at all, and the Storm Father specifically referenced Odium as the most dangerous of the 16, so he knows about the other shards.  And one of Honor's messages to Dalinar in the vision specifically mentions that he can't fight "him" any longer, not "them".  My best guess for why Odium would try to take on Honor and Cultivation alone is that he assumed he could pit them against each other, as he likely did against Devotion and Dominion.  But Devotion and Dominion were already opposed to each other, and I don't think Honor and Cultivation were.  So I think Odium underestimated how united they'd be against him. 

[alder24]

Just to make myself clear - I don't want to argue that this is what happened, that Odium had the help of another Shard with Splintering Honor. I just wanted to show that there is some evidence to support that claim, contrary to what you've written. 

 

10 hours ago, Letryx13 said:

But so far, there's been nothing mentioning any of the other shards ever being anywhere near Roshar.  The three moons over the planet are supposed to be a reference to the three gods, from what I understand.

Shards don't need to fully invest in Roshar to aid Odium. There are multitudes of ways for Shards to attack Honor without being in Roshar.

TLM spoilers:

Spoiler

Just like Autonomy created her Avator on Scadrial, some Shard could do the same, or even less - blind Honor's future vision, attack him indirectly and possibly many other ways. They don't need to get invested on Roshar and none would realize what is happening, except Shards. 

 

10 hours ago, Letryx13 said:

And while it's true that Cultivation helped Honor against Odium, the biggest thing we know of is that her power combined with Honor's to trap Odium.  At least, according to the Storm Father.

I don't remember that it was said Cultivation directly trapped Odium with her power alongside Honor. I can be wrong here but it was said it is all Honor's doing and that Honor alone has the power to release Odium. 

However both Honor and Cultivation allowed Odium to enter and settle on Roshar. This in my opinion is what caused Honor's death - he broke his promise and imprisoned Odium on Roshar permanently. That left him exposed and Odium finished him. But Cultivation was not involved in the trap - she didn't break her word to Odium and didn't expose herself to his strikes. Otherwise she would be slowly dying through all those years (just like Leras). That was likely part of Honor and Cultivation's plan - one would trap Odium in the system, the other will continue fighting against him, helping humanity to make sure Odium will never find a way out of this trap.

Spoiler

Questioner

It’s really heavily implied in the first Oathbringer letter that the Shards made a pact not to settle near each other. Given that a full half of the Shards ended up doing that, what is the cost for them breaking that oath? You implied earlier that there’s always a cost for Hoid, for taking his protections.

Brandon Sanderson

The wording of those things allows them to agree together, but it also gives them a little bit of power over one another, and you’ve seen the side effects of that on the planets where it’s happened. It has not gone well for any of them, if you kind of run the numbers on that. But the wording of it allows two, later on, to say, "Okay, we both agree." (If one said no and one said yes, then they were in trouble.) This should imply to you that Odium did get permission, as well.

Dragonsteel 2022 (Nov. 14, 2022)

 

Spoiler

R'Shara

Did Honor and Cultivation binding Odium to the Roshar system directly cause the death stroke to Honor?

Brandon Sanderson

*sighs indecisively for a good ten seconds* RAFO. It's fiddly.

YouTube Spoiler Stream 5 (Dec. 2, 2022)

 

10 hours ago, Letryx13 said:

But there wasn't much mention of her being involved in the desolations, since most of the humans on Roshar don't know about her.  Dalinar wasn't even aware there was a third god until Odium mentioned her.  So I don't think she played much of a role in the desolations after things got started.

That's wrong. In the eastern, Vorin side of Roshar, Cultivation is forgotten or treated as a pagan superstition, that's true, but that's not the case in the west. There she is still worshiped and people remember her and know about her to some degree. In the times of Radiants, from Coppermind: "Cultivation has been honored on Roshar for a long time, at least since the era of the Knights Radiant"

And we know she was fighting against Odium with Honor. Radiants are the evidence of it. They're using powers which are the combination of both Honor and Cultivation's power. True spren are a mixture of both Honor and Cultivation and there are literally Cultivation spren, Nightwatcher, and many Radiant orders whose Oaths are accepted not by Stormfather, but by Cultivation herself. She was and is highly involved in the fight against Odium - she literally perpetrated a coup which killed Odium's Vessel, Rayse. How much more involved she needs to be?

Spoiler

Gavin-son-son-Odegard

How does Cultivation figure in this conflict between Odium?

Brandon Sanderson

So, what people assume is that Cultivation is hiding. I would disagree with that. People in-world would assume that.

Oathbringer London signing (Nov. 28, 2017)

 

Spoiler

Seonid

If Cultivation and Honor were romantically involved, why did Cultivation not help Honor against Odium?

Brandon Sanderson

She did.

Idaho Falls Signing (Nov. 28, 2015)

 

Spoiler

FirstSelector

Was Cultivation close enough to when Odium got  Honor, to know how to fight back?

Brandon Sanderson

Heheheheh. I would say yes.

FirstSelector

And Cultivation, is she--

Brandon Sanderson

She is still there.

FirstSelector

Alive and kicking. Okay, you've said that before--

Brandon Sanderson

She is alive and kicking.

FirstSelector

And she can probably know how to not turn her back to the--

Brandon Sanderson

Well, I mean... She has learned from the experiences of others.

Arcanum Unbounded Chicago signing (Dec. 6, 2016)

 

10 hours ago, Letryx13 said:

Sure, Autonomy or a different shard could have helped Odium in a deal with him for one reason or another.  But there's been no mention of that at all, and the Storm Father specifically referenced Odium as the most dangerous of the 16, so he knows about the other shards.

There is little to no information about Honor's death at all, that leaves a lot of room for speculation. Stormfather wasn't fully sentient back there, he has foggy memories of those events. A partial involvement of another Shard, blinding Honor's vision, would be missed by Stormfather back then.

10 hours ago, Letryx13 said:

And one of Honor's messages to Dalinar in the vision specifically mentions that he can't fight "him" any longer, not "them".

I didn't suggest that for thousands of years Odium was fighting with the help of other Shards. No. Likely someone just got to Roshar at the very last moment to aid Odium with a finishing blow, not earlier.

10 hours ago, Letryx13 said:

My best guess for why Odium would try to take on Honor and Cultivation alone is that he assumed he could pit them against each other, as he likely did against Devotion and Dominion.

That's not true. Firstly Honor and Cultivation were romantically involved, they wouldn't turn against each other just like that and Rayse knew it for sure. The same is likely with Devotion and Dominion - they could be also romantically involved. This wouldn't give Odium any way to Splinter them. But there was an agreement made by all Vessels not to settle in the same system, as Endowment said in the OB letter. The pact wasn't a strongly binding Oath, but it still gave a little edge to Odium, as he can argue that they all violated this agreement. And that's likely what he used to Splinter Aona and Skai, and what he wanted to do with Honor and Cultivation too.

Plus we know Autonomy was somewhat involved in Splinening of Devotion and Dominion. Odium didn't do that alone either.

Spoiler

StormAtlas (paraphrased)

Were Cultivation and Honor romantically involved?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Yes.

Rithmatist Albuquerque signing (May 22, 2013)

 

Spoiler

Menderbug

What was Aona and Skai's relationship (like e.g. Cultivation's vessel and Tanavast were lovers)?

Brandon Sanderson

RAFO!

Miscellaneous 2020 (Nov. 30, 2020)

 

Spoiler

Paladin Brewer

Out of all the Shards, why does Odium go for Devotion and Dominion?

Brandon Sanderson

He targets people with two kinds of ideas. Number one, he can argue they're breaking the rules they set out. And two, people he thinks are a good match for him, or a challenge, or a danger.

Oathbringer Houston signing (Nov. 18, 2017)

 

Spoiler

Khyrindor

Odium seems to have a bad track record when it comes to killing Shards. He was wounded versus Ambition, and he's trapped on Roshar. Yet, he's credited in killing Devotion and Dominion. My question is: was Autonomy significantly involved and would Odium have been able to do it on his own and still be okay to--

Brandon Sanderson

RAFO. It is dangerous to attack a Shard with one Shard. Let's say that. And a wise Shard would try to avoid that confrontation unless there are specific reasons they think they would have an advantage.

Skyward Seattle signing (Nov. 10, 2018)

 

Spoiler

Mason Wheeler

One of the Letters in Oathbringer suggests that the Shards had a pact to all go their separate ways. And some of them held to it and some of them didn't?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

Mason Wheeler

Out of all of them, how is it possible that one of the ones that didn't is the one whose nature is to obsessively keep your word at all costs?

Brandon Sanderson

He would argue that he kept his word.

Mason Wheeler

Okay, so loophole.

Brandon Sanderson

He wouldn't even call it a loophole.

Legion Release Party (Sept. 19, 2018)

 

Spoiler

Moridin997 (paraphrased)

Did Bavadin in any way help Odium splinter Dominion and Devotion?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Uhh...

Moridin997 (paraphrased)

(sensing an incoming RAFO): In any way...

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Uhh... Yes... Yes, you could say that...

Lisbon signing (Nov. 7, 2016)

 

[therunner he/him]

On 07/06/2023 at 10:36 PM, Quantus said:

Another corollary theory is that Cultivation has specifically prepared replacement vessels for each of the three Shards in Dalinar, Lift, and MrT.

I like that theory! I was thinking along similar lines but thought it kind of crazy.

I have elaborated on it in new thread:

 

Edited June 13, 2023 by therunner

[Letryx13]

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

Just to make myself clear - I don't want to argue that this is what happened, that Odium had the help of another Shard with Splintering Honor. I just wanted to show that there is some evidence to support that claim, contrary to what you've written. 

Not really arguing with you either; it just seems like while it's certainly possible that Odium had help, there's nothing beyond speculation that he did. I'm not saying at all that he couldn't have had help from one of the other shards, I just don't think there's enough to say that it actually happened.  

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

Shards don't need to fully invest in Roshar to aid Odium. There are multitudes of ways for Shards to attack Honor without being in Roshar.

True, but so far, there's nothing to suggest that's happened.

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

I don't remember that it was said Cultivation directly trapped Odium with her power alongside Honor. I can be wrong here but it was said it is all Honor's doing and that Honor alone has the power to release Odium. 

However both Honor and Cultivation allowed Odium to enter and settle on Roshar. This in my opinion is what caused Honor's death - he broke his promise and imprisoned Odium on Roshar permanently. That left him exposed and Odium finished him. But Cultivation was not involved in the trap - she didn't break her word to Odium and didn't expose herself to his strikes. Otherwise she would be slowly dying through all those years (just like Leras). That was likely part of Honor and Cultivation's plan - one would trap Odium in the system, the other will continue fighting against him, helping humanity to make sure Odium will never find a way out of this trap.

The Storm Father explicitly states that it's the combined power of Honor and Cultivation that keeps Odium bound.  He compares the Oathpact to that binding when revealing the history of the heralds to Dalinar and Navani.

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

That's wrong. In the eastern, Vorin side of Roshar, Cultivation is forgotten or treated as a pagan superstition, that's true, but that's not the case in the west. There she is still worshiped and people remember her and know about her to some degree. In the times of Radiants, from Coppermind: "Cultivation has been honored on Roshar for a long time, at least since the era of the Knights Radiant"

And we know she was fighting against Odium with Honor. Radiants are the evidence of it. They're using powers which are the combination of both Honor and Cultivation's power. True spren are a mixture of both Honor and Cultivation and there are literally Cultivation spren, Nightwatcher, and many Radiant orders whose Oaths are accepted not by Stormfather, but by Cultivation herself. She was and is highly involved in the fight against Odium - she literally perpetrated a coup which killed Odium's Vessel, Rayse. How much more involved she needs to be?

I actually forgot that she was revered in eastern Roshar. It just always seemed like if she was involved in the fight against Odium, then she would have taken over Honor's role as a unifying deity after his death.  But then again she's more about nature than people, so it all feel murky.

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

There is little to no information about Honor's death at all, that leaves a lot of room for speculation. Stormfather wasn't fully sentient back there, he has foggy memories of those events. A partial involvement of another Shard, blinding Honor's vision, would be missed by Stormfather back then.

Possible, sure.  But there's nothing to suggest that happened.  

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

I didn't suggest that for thousands of years Odium was fighting with the help of other Shards. No. Likely someone just got to Roshar at the very last moment to aid Odium with a finishing blow, not earlier.

Again, possible, but nothing to suggest it happened either. 

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

That's not true. Firstly Honor and Cultivation were romantically involved, they wouldn't turn against each other just like that and Rayse knew it for sure. The same is likely with Devotion and Dominion - they could be also romantically involved. This wouldn't give Odium any way to Splinter them. But there was an agreement made by all Vessels not to settle in the same system, as Endowment said in the OB letter. The pact wasn't a strongly binding Oath, but it still gave a little edge to Odium, as he can argue that they all violated this agreement. And that's likely what he used to Splinter Aona and Skai, and what he wanted to do with Honor and Cultivation too.

Plus we know Autonomy was somewhat involved in Splinening of Devotion and Dominion. Odium didn't do that alone either.

As you yourself said, we don't know much about Honor's death, so it's hard to say how his death differs from Devotion and Dominion.  I admit, I didn't know that Autonomy was involved in what happed to Devotion and Dominion, but we still don't really know what happened with them either, aside from their power being locked away somehow.  Sure, Odium probably used the original agreement between the 16 against them, but Sanderson has also confirmed the the shards of Devotion and Dominion oppose each other, and that likely played a role too.

As for Honor and Cultivation being united, while Rayse may have known they were a couple before ascending, the power of the shards can change people, as proved by Ati and Ruin.  One of the WoB you referenced suggests that Aona and Skye were a couple before ascending as well, but we know they opposed each other after ascending. The power can change people, and Odium knows that.

But this is a tangent.  If you want to debate this further, let's start a new topic.

[alder24]

24 minutes ago, Letryx13 said:

Sanderson has also confirmed the the shards of Devotion and Dominion oppose each other, and that likely played a role too.

24 minutes ago, Letryx13 said:

One of the WoB you referenced suggests that Aona and Skye were a couple before ascending as well, but we know they opposed each other after ascending. The power can change people, and Odium knows that.

Their intent was in opposition. Only intent. There is nothing to suggest they were actively opposing each other, fighting against each other's actions. From the Arcanum Unbounded:

Spoiler

They were both passive towards development of humans and their cultures, they weren't involved with them nor influenced them directly.

That early on after the Shattering it's very likely they weren't strongly influenced by their intent and were still fully in control.

Is this the WoB you mentioned?

Spoiler

Questioner

So we know that you can't just have someone-- If someone were to do something similar to Hoid, he can't just pop and go "Oh look, I can now do Allomancy or I can now do Surgebinding". What about Breath? If someone could somebody get Breath-- Maybe not *audio obscured* Could they still get the benefits of--

Brandon Sanderson

Oh, good question... Yes you can, actually. Breath is-- Once it is given to you, it is being keyed to you. Your Identity. So that transfer makes it yours to use however you want.

Questioner

So you could Awaken?

Brandon Sanderson

You could Awaken. If you-- If you were to somehow make it there, you would be able to Awaken. It's the easiest of magic systems to get the magic from, and then to manipulate. Because it has keyed into it Identity.

Questioner

*audio obscured*

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, you can take Breath onto another world. In fact, you've seen characters do this.

Questioner

*audio obscured*

Brandon Sanderson

It would work, yes.

Questioner

*audio obscured*

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, it would work the same way.

The only magic that is location-dependent--  The ones who aren't interested in this, just hum to yourself, okay? *laughter* You don't need to know any of this stuff to enjoy the books, okay? I write them so that you could just-- each series can be read independently, and enjoyed. There is behind the scenes stuff, and if you want to dig, it goes pretty deep.

So on Sel, we have AonDor. AonDor is based on the fact that the Dor, which is an amalgamation of Dominion and Devotion, has been pressed together and stuffed into the Cognitive Realm by Odium who didn't want it to gain sentience, as Investiture will do if it is left alone. It will either seek someone to be its Vessel or it will gain sentience. He pressed it in there; he pressed it together, which creates the violent reaction, because those two intents are opposed. And that is the foundation of the magic. Because it's stuck in the Cognitive Realm rather than the Spiritual Realm (the Spiritual Realm is location-independent; Cognitive Realm is location-dependent), it makes the magic on Sel only work in close proximity to what is keyed through there to the location they're keyed to. This has to do with Identity and Connection. Mostly Connection. So that means you can't do AonDor on another planet, but you can do other magics works anywhere, because they're drawing the magics specifically through either the place, or they're end-neutral, like Breath is, and you don't need any extra power.

Arcanum Unbounded Chicago signing (Dec. 6, 2016)

 

[Dalinar_Kholin]

I will unite them. I am Unity.