Kaladin in Rythm of War and the effects of Odium

[Honer]

This whole post is spoilers through rythm of war, so don’t read unless you have finished it. 

Spoiler

So, we see towards the end of RoW that when Kaladin witnesses the death of Teft, and is subsequently “triggered” by The Pursuer, his eyes glow red. I believe this to be caused because of how much rage, how much odium(emotion) he is feeling towards both The Pursuer and Moash, that he is able to channel the shard Odium. I feel that if Kaladin wanted to, he had the Connection requirement to use Voidlight. In addition, I feel that his surgbinding was augmented by the effects, giving him similar potency to a heavenly one, or possibly more. I feel that other effects may have been possible as well.

Would love it if I could get some feedback on this (probably crempot) theory.

[Treamayne]

12 hours ago, Honer said:

This whole post is spoilers through rythm of war, so don’t read unless you have finished it. 

  Hide contents

So, we see towards the end of RoW that when Kaladin witnesses the death of Teft, and is subsequently “triggered” by The Pursuer, his eyes glow red. I believe this to be caused because of how much rage, how much odium(emotion) he is feeling towards both The Pursuer and Moash, that he is able to channel the shard Odium. I feel that if Kaladin wanted to, he had the Connection requirement to use Voidlight. In addition, I feel that his surgbinding was augmented by the effects, giving him similar potency to a heavenly one, or possibly more. I feel that other effects may have been possible as well.

Would love it if I could get some feedback on this (probably crempot) theory.

Yes, it is likely that at that time, something was going on and he may have been using Voidlight and Stormlight together (or maybe something else). Though, his eyes are not actually Red in that scene (RoW Ch 106):

Spoiler

Kaladin Stormblessed looked up and let loose a howl that seemed to vibrate with a hundred discordant rhythms. Venli attuned the Lost in return.

The Pursuer stabbed, but Stormblessed grabbed his arm and turned, becoming a blur of motion. He somehow twisted around so he was behind the Pursuer, then found a knife somewhere on his person—moving with such speed that Venli had trouble tracking him. Stormblessed slammed the knife at the Pursuer’s neck, who barely ejected from the husk in time.

He re-formed and tried to grab Stormblessed again. But there was no contest now. Kaladin moved like the wind, fast and flowing as he rammed his dagger through the Pursuer’s arm, causing him to shout in pain. A knife toward the face followed, and the Pursuer ejected yet again. No one chanted or shouted this time, but when Stormblessed turned around, Venli saw his face—and she immediately attuned the Terrors.

His eyes were glowing like a Radiant’s, his face a mask of pain and anguish, but the eyes … she swore the light had a yellowish-red cast to it. Like … like …

The Pursuer appeared near the soldiers at the perimeter by the wall. 

Note: He was not holding Stormlight, nor did he breath any in that we see; but he is moving faster then even Stormlight would account for. So, something was happening, but we don't yet have enough information on exactly what that was.

Odium's color, however, is Gold (Red is investiture that has been changed by some other investiture - WoBs - Emperor's Soul Spoilers):

Spoiler

Quote

Roger

As I understand it, red is a sign of corruption in the cosmere. I just reread The Emperor's Soul, and it mentioned wisps of red smoke when Shai tests the Soulstamps. Does this mean she is corrupting Gaotona's soul?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, that is what that means. Corruption doesn't have to have the negative connotation, right? Basically, it means an outside influence is changing the Spiritual nature of the soul. And, yeah, that's exactly what is happening right there. Now, I would call that a pretty good thing, but... like, all of those things, where she is playing with someone's soul, and changing it, and changing their past, and things like this. This is, by cosmere definition, corrupting someone's soul. That's expressly what it is.

YouTube Livestream 10 (June 18, 2020)

Quote

Questioner

Is such a motif present in any other books? I think I see it in Stormlight.

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, in Stormlight you can see it. So, Ruin is a red-gold... not Ruin, Odium. Odium is a red-gold. Honor is a blue-white and Cultivation is green, obviously. So, those motifs stay, when you... when you see a red or a gold, it's a reddish gold sort of thing, either of those colors, it's going to be Odium.

Questioner

Even when we something we might suspect to be outside influence in other worlds?

Brandon Sanderson

Not necessarily, because red can also mean corrupted Investiture in the Cosmere. So, I would call Odium's real color gold, because you're going to see red when Odium is corrupting other things, so...

ICon 2019 (Oct. 15, 2019)

So, likely "yellowish" for Odium's influence, and redish for the corrupted investiture combining to make the "Yellowish-red" glow

RoW Ch 112:

Quote

“My life? Odium, I intend to be my own champion. I’ll have died if you win.”

“Yes,” Odium said, eyes shining golden. “You will have.

 

 

Edited January 1 by Treamayne
SPAG

[alder24]

12 hours ago, Honer said:

So, we see towards the end of RoW that when Kaladin witnesses the death of Teft, and is subsequently “triggered” by The Pursuer, his eyes glow red. I believe this to be caused because of how much rage, how much odium(emotion) he is feeling towards both The Pursuer and Moash, that he is able to channel the shard Odium. I feel that if Kaladin wanted to, he had the Connection requirement to use Voidlight. In addition, I feel that his surgbinding was augmented by the effects, giving him similar potency to a heavenly one, or possibly more. I feel that other effects may have been possible as well.

Would love it if I could get some feedback on this (probably crempot) theory.

There is no need to hide RoW content in spoiler boxes. It's fine to talk about this openly.

Odium was carefully forging his Connection to Kaladin in previous weeks through Moash. Odium needed to break Kaladin mentally for him to give up his pain to Odium like Moash did - that was Odium's goal. Here it kind of failed because of the Pursuer. He triggered Kaladin's response, but Kaladin was barely in control of himself and we don't really know what happened there. Kaladin is certainly influenced by Odium and this point, gold and red eyes are a clear indication of that. But Kaladin instead of giving up his pain to Odium, channeled it towards action, which made him really dangerous. I wouldn't be surprised if Kaladin was subconsciously using this Connection to Odium and drawing power from him directly thus that's why he became so fast.

But he didn't use Voidlight to fuel his Surges. He couldn't have done that because he was bound to a Honorspren, not Voidspren, nor Corrupted Spren. Venli can use Voidlight because she has a Voidspren trapped inside her gemstone, but fabrials without Voidspren or Corrupted spren can't use Voidlight. He didn't used the Surge of Gravitation:

Quote

Stormblessed looked up, then launched into the air using the strange fabrial that mimicked the Lashings.

However he did use something to fuel his Full Lashing, and it didn't look like Stormlight in Venli's opinion. I wouldn't be surprised if that was some kind of corrupted Stormlight or even Warlight (it's black-blue, so it wouldn't glow as strong as Stormlight) but it's possible it was just Voidlight. Or maybe it was raw Odium's investiture? Hard to say what it was.

Quote

In that moment, Kaladin did something to the window. As he stepped back, he left the Pursuer stuck to the glass, immobilized and lacking the Voidlight to eject his soul. Kaladin didn’t attack. Instead he reached down and infused the ground, but with power that didn’t glow as strong as she thought it should.

[Duxredux he/him]

Yeah... Odium probably was trying to turn Kaladin, and not just so that he would commit suicide. Agreed, something was going on there. The thing that I'm trying to figure out is that Kaladin's glowing yellowish-red eyes seemed to be reminding Venli of something. It probably wasn't the Thrill, and it wasn't the glowing eyes of a Fused (I don't think), but I'm not sure what it could be. Yellowish-red has to be very intentional wording as opposed to say... orange. 

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

However he did use something to fuel his Full Lashing, and it didn't look like Stormlight in Venli's opinion. I wouldn't be surprised if that was some kind of corrupted Stormlight or even Warlight (it's black-blue, so it wouldn't glow as strong as Stormlight) but it's possible it was just Voidlight. Or maybe it was raw Odium's investiture? Hard to say what it was.

Quote

In that moment, Kaladin did something to the window. As he stepped back, he left the Pursuer stuck to the glass, immobilized and lacking the Voidlight to eject his soul. Kaladin didn’t attack. Instead he reached down and infused the ground, but with power that didn’t glow as strong as she thought it should.

I'll note that he probably used a Reverse Lashing on the floor, not a Full Lashing, and those are supernaturally darker than all other Windrunner Lashings as they draw even light towards them. Reverse Lashings are rarely used, so this could be simple unfamiliarity on Venli's part. It doesn't discount this as a different Investiture, but it doesn't rule out Stormlight either. 

[alder24]

2 hours ago, Duxredux said:

I'll note that he probably used a Reverse Lashing on the floor, not a Full Lashing,

Full Lashing applied on the window, but my mistake, Reverse Lashing on the floor.

2 hours ago, Duxredux said:

those are supernaturally darker than all other Windrunner Lashings as they draw even light towards them. Reverse Lashings are rarely used, so this could be simple unfamiliarity on Venli's part. It doesn't discount this as a different Investiture, but it doesn't rule out Stormlight either. 

True.

[Treamayne]

10 hours ago, alder24 said:

However he did use something to fuel his Full  Reverse Lashing, and it didn't look like Stormlight in Venli's opinion. 

Spoiler

In that moment, Kaladin did something to the window. As he stepped back, he left the Pursuer stuck to the glass, immobilized and lacking the Voidlight to eject his soul. Kaladin didn’t attack. Instead he reached down and infused the ground, but with power that didn’t glow as strong as she thought it should.

 

7 hours ago, Duxredux said:

I'll note that he probably used a Reverse Lashing on the floor, not a Full Lashing, and those are supernaturally darker than all other Windrunner Lashings as they draw even light towards them. 

It was said in RoW Ch 49 that paired surges that are being partially blocked by the Inhibitor have their Stormlight color dimmed:

Spoiler

 You say Gravitation Lashings don’t work, and Adhesion ones do. What about a Reverse Lashing?”

“Haven’t tried,” Kaladin admitted. He stepped to the side and drew the Stormlight out of a different lantern. He felt the energy, the power, in his veins—something he’d been yearning for. He smiled and stepped back, alight with power.

“Try making the glass attract the latch,” Syl said, gesturing. “If you can get the latch to move toward you, it will pop out and unlock.”

He touched the side of the lantern housing. During the last year, he’d practiced his Lashings. Sigzil had monitored, making him do experiments, as usual. They’d found that a Reverse Lashing required a command—or at least a visualization of what you wanted. As he infused the glass, he tried to imagine the Stormlight attracting things.

No, not things. The latch specifically.

The Stormlight resisted. As with the basic gravitational Lashing, he could feel the power, but something blocked it. However, the blockage was weaker here. He concentrated, pushing harder, and—like a floodgate opening—the Light suddenly burst from him. A Reverse Lashing didn’t glow as brightly as it should, considering the Stormlight. It was kind of inverted, in a way. But Kaladin’s actions were followed by a faint click.