Adolin shardblade

[maxal she/her]

6 hours ago, galendo said:

Eh, it's no big deal.  I was just taken aback because, like I said, I can frequently tell a person's gender from their writing.  I test myself sometimes, on books where I've forgotten the author's name (which happens more often to me than you might think) or when the name itself is gender-neutral, and I'm right far more frequently than not.  I never dug into your profile because I honestly don't really care either way.  Er, don't take that as an insult.  It's just that there are a lot of people on the Internet, and most information on people's profiles just doesn't matter much in cyberspace, gender included.

Anyway, apologies to all for semi-derailing the thread with an offhand comment.  Let's see if we can bring it back to Adolin and Shardblades.  Here's a question: say Adolin somehow revives his Blade.  Now, at present the Blade's spren pretty clearly has the ability to manifest itself as a Blade.  Would being revived make it lose that ability?  If not, would Adolin get a Blade-spren earlier than other Radiants of the same order?  Or would he have to speak enough Ideals to get to the "physical Blade" level in order to revive the spren in the first place?

 I am not offended in the slightest way. I found it funny and amusing, not insulting. You certainly aren't the first to put me into the wrong gender and, as I said, I don't typically bother to correct people when they do unless it is relevant to the discussion at hand. Besides, I too try to figure out the gender of most other posters and no, I don't always go and check if their profile confirms my thoughts. I am quite sure there are a few out there I have wrongly place-hold into the wrong gender  

So back to our main subject... This is something I had given some thoughts about. What would happen to Adolin's Blade shall he revive it? Will it still be able to appear in its physical form or would it go back to spren form up until he progresses far enough? My thoughts are Adolin needs to say more than one oaths to revive his Blade, worst I think he needs to say as many as obtaining the Blade physical form of his order would demand. The general rule is three, but it may be more for some orders. I have thus settled myself on Adolin needing to say at least three oaths before the spren can be revived. I think to unlock the Blade, you need to progress at least as far which is another reason why it is practically impossible. Not only do you need to be compatible to the order, not only do you need to be someone this particular spren would have chosen (though we have had inkling perhaps Edgedancers sprens do NOT choose their knights, the Nightwatcher does it for them.... which could lead to Adolin's spren being in trouble for having gone above the rules) you also need to progress up to a Level 3 Radiant (assumed) without the guidance of a spren and the help of surgebinding.

In other words, Adolin will be left in the dark as to what he is doing. 

32 minutes ago, goody153 said:

but don't their personal spren say that they "aren't a KR yet" whenever they ask and i think Kaladin proclaiming the KR have returned was just like how he spoke the Oaths that it came naturally for him not some boast/random declaration he made. Since i think Syl would've told Kaladin about that. 

also may i know where it says that a KR needs to have spoken all the five oaths, i may have missed this part or didn't read a WoB about it

 

edit : Though if i think about it being officially a KR may actually just be a title and the moment they got access to surges and Shardblade probably already turned them in a KR .

Technically, in the days of old, our little crew of Radiants would be considered "Radiants in training", not full fledged ones.

[Argel he/him]

3 hours ago, maxal said:

Technically, in the days of old, our little crew of Radiants would be considered "Radiants in training", not full fledged ones.

Yeah, what a mess things are this time around. I would count Jasnah, Shallan, Kaladin, and Dalinar as "good-enough" to be called KRs (with that order of progression). Renarin is an unknown, and Lift has some more learning to do.

Agree Adolin will likely awaken his blade without realizing what he is doing and I think that fits his character. Though who knows -- Renarin or Shallan (more so if Adolin and her stay together) could help out. 

[Naurock]

6 hours ago, maxal said:

 I am not offended in the slightest way. I found it funny and amusing, not insulting. You certainly aren't the first to put me into the wrong gender and, as I said, I don't typically bother to correct people when they do unless it is relevant to the discussion at hand. Besides, I too try to figure out the gender of most other posters and no, I don't always go and check if their profile confirms my thoughts. I am quite sure there are a few out there I have wrongly place-hold into the wrong gender  

So back to our main subject... This is something I had given some thoughts about. What would happen to Adolin's Blade shall he revive it? Will it still be able to appear in its physical form or would it go back to spren form up until he progresses far enough? My thoughts are Adolin needs to say more than one oaths to revive his Blade, worst I think he needs to say as many as obtaining the Blade physical form of his order would demand. The general rule is three, but it may be more for some orders. I have thus settled myself on Adolin needing to say at least three oaths before the spren can be revived. I think to unlock the Blade, you need to progress at least as far which is another reason why it is practically impossible. Not only do you need to be compatible to the order, not only do you need to be someone this particular spren would have chosen (though we have had inkling perhaps Edgedancers sprens do NOT choose their knights, the Nightwatcher does it for them.... which could lead to Adolin's spren being in trouble for having gone above the rules) you also need to progress up to a Level 3 Radiant (assumed) without the guidance of a spren and the help of surgebinding.

In other words, Adolin will be left in the dark as to what he is doing. 

Technically, in the days of old, our little crew of Radiants would be considered "Radiants in training", not full fledged ones.

Why would he have to speak Oaths to unlock the blade? Kaladin didn't need to speak any oaths but was still able to form a bond with Syl, and start subconsciously using stormlight to heal and improve his stamina/fighting abilities. Maybe by Adolin curing the spren's insanity and "unlocking" the spren's form he would lose it's ability to transform to a blade until oaths are spoken, but gain surge abilities through a Nahel bond.

If Adolin was so suited to be an edge dancer and cured a broken spren he could maybe progress through the oaths faster than Kaladin has, because Kaladin had to have the character breakthrough to understand why he lost Syl and what protecting means.

[The One Who Connects he/him]

24 minutes ago, Naurock said:

Why would he have to speak Oaths to unlock the blade?

I don't speak for Maxal, but Brandon has alluded that reviving a blade would be very difficult without the original Radiant. I imagine that has something to do with reviving their oaths. Keep in mind that short of Syl saying "I was only as dead as your oaths," I don't have anything else to back this up.

[Krandacth]

7 hours ago, maxal said:

What would happen to Adolin's Blade shall he revive it? Will it still be able to appear in its physical form or would it go back to spren form up until he progresses far enough? My thoughts are Adolin needs to say more than one oaths to revive his Blade, worst I think he needs to say as many as obtaining the Blade physical form of his order would demand.

I'd be interested to hear if you have a specific reason for this.  You see, I have a theory, linked below, that predicts that Adolin would need to have adopted the first X ideals (as normally required for the Edgedancer Blade to manifest), though not necessarily have vocalised the oaths.  However, my theory predicts it would be harder still, requiring the bearer of the dead Blade to have suffered very similar spiritual trauma to that suffered by the Blade's original owner.  This, I believe, would qualify for the degree of difficulty/impossibility described in the books/WoB (internalising the ideals could be achieved with just some knowledge and a prolonged period of meditation).

 

Edited September 21, 2016 by Krandacth

[maxal she/her]

3 hours ago, Naurock said:

Why would he have to speak Oaths to unlock the blade? Kaladin didn't need to speak any oaths but was still able to form a bond with Syl, and start subconsciously using stormlight to heal and improve his stamina/fighting abilities. Maybe by Adolin curing the spren's insanity and "unlocking" the spren's form he would lose it's ability to transform to a blade until oaths are spoken, but gain surge abilities through a Nahel bond.

If Adolin was so suited to be an edge dancer and cured a broken spren he could maybe progress through the oaths faster than Kaladin has, because Kaladin had to have the character breakthrough to understand why he lost Syl and what protecting means.

Because the Blade's former oaths have been broken. Both Pattern and Syl  have shown us the only way to revive a dead or almost dead spren is to retake the oaths. Reviving Syl has required Kaladin to re-swore the first two oaths he had previously said and to say an additional one. Whereas the third oath was a requirement or not is currently unknown. Besides, we do have a WoB which states Adolin would need to swear the oaths to the Edgedancers, how many however, he hasn't specified, but the prevalent theory is he needs to say at least enough for his Blade to reach physical state. Three is thus assumed, but it may be more.

Adolin just can't revive the Blade without saying the oaths and the Blade will likely be unable to move out of its locked form until it gets a working Nahel bond strong enough for it.

This being said, I do not understand why you say Kaladin has progressed slowly. By all means, he has progressed much faster than anyone else, even if he did momentarily killed Syl. Jasnah has had her Nahel bond for more than 6 years and she is still lagging in terms of progression. Shallan put Pattern in a limbo almost dead mode for six years following the murder of her mother. Dalinar has needed several years of slowly bonding the Stormfather before figuring out what to say/do. Kaladin has made massive leaps in terms of progression, most likely because the circumstances surrounding him have pushed him to evolve faster. Killing Syl also wasn't something he needed to do to progress: he would have figured out the third oaths much sooner, it was only Elhokar's actions which caused him to leap back. In the matter of a few weeks, Kaladin made it from 0 oaths to 3 oaths. Sure Shallan said more truths, but she merely was re-taking what she formally had.

By all means, Adolin can't have anything but a very slow progression: he won't have a spren to guide him, to steer him towards finding the oaths. He also won't have the support of surgebinding: all Radiants have found their oaths while surgebinding or in order to accomplish something with sugebinding. Adolin won't have this. What he'd need to do has to be leaps harder than anything Kaladin did for the mere reason it is practically impossible. 

From my viewpoint, nobody progressed faster than Kaladin.

3 hours ago, The One Who Connects said:

I don't speak for Maxal, but Brandon has alluded that reviving a blade would be very difficult without the original Radiant. I imagine that has something to do with reviving their oaths. Keep in mind that short of Syl saying "I was only as dead as your oaths," I don't have anything else to back this up.

My thoughts are Adolin would need to somehow remind the dead-spren its former knight... There has to be link with the former one or it may be just like Paragon, going against family and deciding who his family should be.

2 hours ago, Krandacth said:

I'd be interested to hear if you have a specific reason for this.  You see, I have a theory, linked below, that predicts that Adolin would need to have adopted the first X ideals (as normally required for the Edgedancer Blade to manifest), though not necessarily have vocalised the oaths.  However, my theory predicts it would be harder still, requiring the bearer of the dead Blade to have suffered very similar spiritual trauma to that suffered by the Blade's original owner.  This, I believe, would qualify for the degree of difficulty/impossibility described in the books/WoB (internalising the ideals could be achieved with just some knowledge and a prolonged period of meditation).

 

I can't say about Adolin needing to have a specific trauma, but he does need to say oaths and I do assume he'd need to say them out loud. Of course, he wouldn't be saying oaths for saying oaths, but he may take a specific commitment, in the heat of the action which would equate to an oath. In other word, he wouldn't have a purpose other than making a promise he would/wouldn't do something very specific which turns out to be exactly what an Edgedancer is all about.

[PantsForSquares he/him]

5 minutes ago, maxal said:

Jasnah has had her Nahel bond for more than 6 years and she is still lagging in terms of progression.

I wouldn't say that she's "lagging" in any sense of the word. In those six years, she's become proficient enough at Soulcasting to Soulcast at a distance (we're not sure if that's a unique perk of Elsecallers), and she's capable enough in Elsecalling to be able to escape from Shadesmar. She's also at least of the Third Ideal, assuming that the Third Ideal always grants a Shardblade.

Jasnah is probably the one fledgling Radiant who has the strongest grasp on her Surges, just because she's naturally the sort of person who would try to learn the most about them, and because she's got the longest known bond to date (maybe besides Ym, but he's a goner).

[Naurock]

22 minutes ago, maxal said:

Because the Blade's former oaths have been broken. Both Pattern and Syl  have shown us the only way to revive a dead or almost dead spren is to retake the oaths. Reviving Syl has required Kaladin to re-swore the first two oaths he had previously said and to say an additional one. Whereas the third oath was a requirement or not is currently unknown. Besides, we do have a WoB which states Adolin would need to swear the oaths to the Edgedancers, how many however, he hasn't specified, but the prevalent theory is he needs to say at least enough for his Blade to reach physical state. Three is thus assumed, but it may be more.

Adolin just can't revive the Blade without saying the oaths and the Blade will likely be unable to move out of its locked form until it gets a working Nahel bond strong enough for it.

This being said, I do not understand why you say Kaladin has progressed slowly. By all means, he has progressed much faster than anyone else, even if he did momentarily killed Syl. Jasnah has had her Nahel bond for more than 6 years and she is still lagging in terms of progression. Shallan put Pattern in a limbo almost dead mode for six years following the murder of her mother. Dalinar has needed several years of slowly bonding the Stormfather before figuring out what to say/do. Kaladin has made massive leaps in terms of progression, most likely because the circumstances surrounding him have pushed him to evolve faster. Killing Syl also wasn't something he needed to do to progress: he would have figured out the third oaths much sooner, it was only Elhokar's actions which caused him to leap back. In the matter of a few weeks, Kaladin made it from 0 oaths to 3 oaths. Sure Shallan said more truths, but she merely was re-taking what she formally had.

I have not seen the WoB you're speaking of saying Adolin would need to speak oaths, I'm sorry. Is there a link to this? If this is the case, I can see why Brandon said it would be near impossible to revive a spren because how would someone form a Nahel bond and speak oaths to a spren with a broken mind.

But I didn't say Kaladin progressed slowly, I just said if Adolin was suited to be an Edgedancer, maybe he progresses faster.

[maxal she/her]

4 hours ago, PantsForSquares said:

I wouldn't say that she's "lagging" in any sense of the word. In those six years, she's become proficient enough at Soulcasting to Soulcast at a distance (we're not sure if that's a unique perk of Elsecallers), and she's capable enough in Elsecalling to be able to escape from Shadesmar. She's also at least of the Third Ideal, assuming that the Third Ideal always grants a Shardblade.

Jasnah is probably the one fledgling Radiant who has the strongest grasp on her Surges, just because she's naturally the sort of person who would try to learn the most about them, and because she's got the longest known bond to date (maybe besides Ym, but he's a goner).

The third oath rule is not universal. Brandon did say most orders require the third oath before allowing Blade manifestation, but not all. We have seen Shallan have a Shardblade prior to having said the equivalent of the third oath. Jasnah may or may not have said her third oath, though I agree it is highly probable she did. 

The reason I say Jasnah's progression has been slow merely is the fact it took her 6 years to master one surge (she can't use elsecalling very well) while Kaladin needed nothing more than a few weeks to achieve the same. I used her example in order to illustrate just how fast Kaladin has progressed when compared to anyone else.

3 hours ago, Naurock said:

I have not seen the WoB you're speaking of saying Adolin would need to speak oaths, I'm sorry. Is there a link to this? If this is the case, I can see why Brandon said it would be near impossible to revive a spren because how would someone form a Nahel bond and speak oaths to a spren with a broken mind.

But I didn't say Kaladin progressed slowly, I just said if Adolin was suited to be an Edgedancer, maybe he progresses faster.

Yes there is.. I'll need to look for it. There are a couple of WoB with respect to Adolin's Blade. I'll try later tonight to locate them, once again. Tedious work this is.

By saying this you are assuming Kaladin is not suited to be a Windrunner and has thus progressed too slowly... I mean, Kaladin mastered everything there was to master within a few weeks. Sure he's had a few bumps, but his progression was so fast it did trial my suspense of disbelieve. Shouldn't it be harder to master a surge? Other examples, namely Shallan and Jasnah, have shown us it can be extremely tricky. 

With his broken bond, I doubt Adolin will progress very fast, the opposite would be surprising suited or not for the order. Besides, if he were this suitable then a spren would have already chosen him. My take is Adolin will become a Radiant by the back door, he'll have to justify himself in front of the Nightwatcher because she won't approve of the broken spren choosing him.

Edit: Here are few relevant WoB:

QUESTION

Cool. I’m not going to bother asking who did right now. With Syl being able to be revived, is Adolin ever going to be able to revive his own blade, or-

BRANDON SANDERSON

Ah, that would be very difficult, as the orig-, in most cases, the original person who broke the oaths has to be the one.

And:

Me- So I noticed during my last read through of WoR that when Adolin summoned his blade, it formed from mist in the shape of vines. Does this mean that the Radiant that the blade was originally bonded to was an Edgedancer?

 

Brandon- Yes, yes it does. (He also had a huge mischievous smile)

 

Me- So I was wondering, if Adolin were to make the same exact oaths, could the Shardblade be revived?

 

Brandon- Something more would have to happen.

 

Me- So it could happen if something else also happened?

 

Brandon- Yes.

 

So he basically said it: Adolin can revive his Blade IF he says the oaths AND something more (which we have speculated on, but have no definite answer)

 

Edited September 22, 2016 by maxal

[goody153]

Quote

This being said, I do not understand why you say Kaladin has progressed slowly. By all means, he has progressed much faster than anyone else, even if he did momentarily killed Syl. 

I actually Dalinar is the one progressed the fastest. I bet the only time he started bonding with stormfather was during the time they started talking to each other at the end. I mean the last interaction before they formed a bond was stormfather trying to kill Dalinar lol

 He literally bullied his spren into forming a bond with him(Stormfather doesn't even want one lol) not the other way around like Pattern following Shallan herself or Syl risking to go out and find Kaladin and conciously following him. 

[Oversleep]

2 minutes ago, goody153 said:

I actually Dalinar is the one progressed the fastest. I bet the only time he started bonding with stormfather was during the time they started talking to each other at the end. I mean the last interaction before they formed a bond was stormfather trying to kill Dalinar lol

Actually the moment Dalinar started receiving the visions was the moment the bond started.

[goody153]

28 minutes ago, Oversleep said:

Actually the moment Dalinar started receiving the visions was the moment the bond started.

Hmm i wouldn't say that i mean Dalinar might not be the only one who received the visions(i suspect Szeth and the others did too). And the fact that the stormfather didn't even bother to check with him after the visions ended, the only time Stormfather talked to him was when he sort of apologized (out of guilt probably) and sent a highstorm to kill them(kinda ironic lol).

Even without the words(or truths in Lightweavers case) spoken the spren is aware enough that he/she is giving the stormlight absorption through nahel bond that is not the case with Stormfather. Dalinar never had that ability until stormfather actually accepted him and stormfather was kinda against bonding so i doubt they actually bonded from the start of the visions

Edited September 22, 2016 by goody153

[maxal she/her]

5 minutes ago, goody153 said:

Hmm i wouldn't say that i mean Dalinar might not be the only one who received the visions(i suspect Szeth and the others did too). And the fact that the stormfather didn't even bother to check with him after the visions ended, the only time Stormfather talked to him was when he sort of apologized (out of guilt probably) and sent a highstorm to kill them(kinda ironic lol).

Even without the words(or truths in Lightweavers case) spoken the spren is aware enough that he/she is giving the stormlight absorption through nahel bond that is not the case with Stormfather. Dalinar never had that ability until stormfather actually accepted him. 

Dalinar has been using stormlight for years which is the only reason he is still capable to yield a sword.

[goody153]

4 minutes ago, maxal said:

Dalinar has been using stormlight for years which is the only reason he is still capable to yield a sword.

He does ? Is there a WoB about this ?  I don't remember reading in his pov that he felt stronger/faster and the effects of stormlight (the feeling of thrill doesn't count since everybody feels that and it's confirmed Odium's influence). I do remember one of the medics complaining about how he is able to move being wounded and stuff on the battle against parshendi at the end of WoR but that was near the end before he bonded with stormfather.

Edited September 22, 2016 by goody153

[Darkness he/him]

there is a surgeon who is shocked at the number of scars Dalinar has. I can't remember the exact reference and I'm on a bus atm, but it's noted that Dalinar shouldn't have been able to go on as he does with that amount of previous injury. It's implied that he's been using stormlight to help his body heal over time. Likely he still has scars because the healing is subconscious and he believes he should have scarring, even if it isn't as bad as it should be. It will be interesting to see if he realizes that he doesn't have to keep all that scar tissue what could a fully healed blackthorn do?

[Naurock]

3 hours ago, maxal said:

Yes there is.. I'll need to look for it. There are a couple of WoB with respect to Adolin's Blade. I'll try later tonight to locate them, once again. Tedious work this is.

By saying this you are assuming Kaladin is not suited to be a Windrunner and has thus progressed too slowly... I mean, Kaladin mastered everything there was to master within a few weeks. Sure he's had a few bumps, but his progression was so fast it did trial my suspense of disbelieve. Shouldn't it be harder to master a surge? Other examples, namely Shallan and Jasnah, have shown us it can be extremely tricky. 

With his broken bond, I doubt Adolin will progress very fast, the opposite would be surprising suited or not for the order. Besides, if he were this suitable then a spren would have already chosen him. My take is Adolin will become a Radiant by the back door, he'll have to justify himself in front of the Nightwatcher because she won't approve of the broken spren choosing him.

 

Thank you for the WoB. But again, I never inferred Kaladin was not suited to be a wind runner. It's quite obvious to me how unusual of a character and how intense his protective nature goes. I've seen a few posts around here stating how they find Kal's POVs annoying with his underlying biases hard to go through. I enjoy his POV's the most, other than Wit/Hoid in the last chapter. Kal has put himself in quite the hard positions at times, and his story is most interesting to me. 

I've seen a lot of posts on here of people asking if Edgedancers is even the order most suited to Adolin, but I don't post on those because I don't know enough about the rest of the orders, which is why I refrain from speculating there. I only said Adolin could progress faster because some people think he's a fantastic proto-radiant for them, that is all.

[Naurock]

17 minutes ago, goody153 said:

He does ? Was there a WoB about this ?  I don't remember reading in his pov that he felt stronger/faster and the effects of stormlight (the feeling of thrill doesn't count since everybody feels that and it's confirmed Odium's influence). I do remember one of the medics complaining about how he is able to move on the battle against parshendi at the end of WoR but that was near the end before he bonded with stormfather.

Dalinar said it when he sucked in stormlight and asked himself if he's been doing it all this time. Stated the feeling was familiar.

[goody153]

10 minutes ago, Darkness said:

there is a surgeon who is shocked at the number of scars Dalinar has. I can't remember the exact reference and I'm on a bus atm, but it's noted that Dalinar shouldn't have been able to go on as he does with that amount of previous injury. It's implied that he's been using stormlight to help his body heal over time. Likely he still has scars because the healing is subconscious and he believes he should have scarring, even if it isn't as bad as it should be. It will be interesting to see if he realizes that he doesn't have to keep all that scar tissue what could a fully healed blackthorn do?

that's the part i referenced though i thought the surgeon only meant his recent wounds at the battle

if this is correct then the scars are just wounds that he perceives as part of himself kinda like Kaladin slave brands 

[goody153]

12 minutes ago, Naurock said:

Dalinar said it when he sucked in stormlight and asked himself if he's been doing it all this time. Stated the feeling was familiar.

I don't think he meant "all his life"

Quote

In response to the question, Dalinar took a sphere from his pocket and held it up. Then he sucked in the Stormlight. He knew to expect the feeling of a storm raging inside, as both Kaladin and Shallan had describedit to him. It urged him to act, to move, to not stand still. It did not, however, feel like the Thrill of battle—which was what he had anticipated.He felt his wounds healing in a familiar way. He’d done this before, he sensed. On the battlefieldearlier? His arm felt fine now, and the cut on his side barely ached anymore.

So he indeed done it when the the surgeon was complaining about him but not on all of his life. Even if he referred it as like "The Thrill of Battle" everybody feels that thrill but that doesn't mean they are absorbing stormlight.

This is just IMO though could be totally wrong

Edited September 22, 2016 by goody153

[If.you.die.I.go.stupid]

3 hours ago, goody153 said:

Hmm i wouldn't say that i mean Dalinar might not be the only one who received the visions(i suspect Szeth and the others did too). And the fact that the stormfather didn't even bother to check with him after the visions ended, the only time Stormfather talked to him was when he sort of apologized (out of guilt probably) and sent a highstorm to kill them(kinda ironic lol).

Even without the words(or truths in Lightweavers case) spoken the spren is aware enough that he/she is giving the stormlight absorption through nahel bond that is not the case with Stormfather. Dalinar never had that ability until stormfather actually accepted him and stormfather was kinda against bonding so i doubt they actually bonded from the start of the visions

 

Fairly sure Dalinar isn't the only one to see the visions. One of the death gasps is said to be from a man who saw strange visions during high storms.  Seems likely they would be the same sort of visions that Dalinar see, but I guess they could be different.  

I don't see why others seeing visions would rule out a bond with the storm father. Honor left the visions behind somehow. I think the storm father was left the task of making sure someone sees the visions. Maybe he wasn't specifically instructed to, maybe he just feels obligated to for some reason.  Some level of bond may be required for the visions. He is obviously resistant to a full bond but may have initiated the bonding process because of his obligation to make sure the visions are seen.  

[Yata he/him]

8 hours ago, maxal said:

We have seen Shallan have a Shardblade prior to having said the equivalent of the third oath. Jasnah may or may not have said her third oath

Sorry Maxal but this is (probably) untrue. Shallan has probably spoken their 2 truths as a child and develop Patternblade (It's stupid but I love the name) then she made Pattern flee and their bond almost broke (for the nature of her Order is possible they may develop quite faster in crisis situation....maybe her mum attempt to kill her was a source of a truth, something like "my mother doesn't love me")

In the first book She "thinks" she may summon a Shardblade but she never actual did it (their attempt to summon it made them capable of her fist Soulcast but actually this stop her from the summon). The first time she actually summon Patterblade (after her Shipwreck) and at this point she already told again two truths ("I am scary" and "I killed my father" probably not the exact wording but my book isn't in english) that are equals to the Third Oath for another order.

Edited September 22, 2016 by Yata

[bdoble97]

So will they be able to creat new Shardblades and shardplate. And what about thoses semi Shardshields. Im thimk they are going to need as much shard wepons they can get in the next book. 

[DeTess she/her]

3 minutes ago, bdoble97 said:

So will they be able to creat new Shardblades and shardplate. And what about thoses semi Shardshields. Im thimk they are going to need as much shard wepons they can get in the next book. 

The first part of your question is answered in WoR. As for shardplate, I'll keep that as probably, but RAFO.

[maxal she/her]

8 hours ago, Naurock said:

Thank you for the WoB. But again, I never inferred Kaladin was not suited to be a wind runner. It's quite obvious to me how unusual of a character and how intense his protective nature goes. I've seen a few posts around here stating how they find Kal's POVs annoying with his underlying biases hard to go through. I enjoy his POV's the most, other than Wit/Hoid in the last chapter. Kal has put himself in quite the hard positions at times, and his story is most interesting to me. 

I've seen a lot of posts on here of people asking if Edgedancers is even the order most suited to Adolin, but I don't post on those because I don't know enough about the rest of the orders, which is why I refrain from speculating there. I only said Adolin could progress faster because some people think he's a fantastic proto-radiant for them, that is all.

Thanks for explaining. Do not get too bothered by others finding Kaladin annoying at times. I do am often annoyed by Kaladin and while I love to rant against his character (seriously ranting against Kaladin is super easy and actually fun in a guilty kinda of way), the fact remains I still enjoyed his arc when I read it, except for the prison and the chasm, but the rest of it, I truly enjoyed. The thing about Kaladin is a great large chunk of the story currently focuses on him and, two years and a half after reading WoR, there are quite a few people who wish the author would also focus on other characters. Reasons are various, some feel we have spend enough time with Kaladin and feel he doesn't need such an introspective POV anymore, some feel his story arc became slightly too convenient and wish for something a tad more unpredictable and finally there are those who feel other characters are currently in need of more development and aren't seeing it happening is the focus remains on Kaladin. So huh, don't get phased out by others perhaps seeing as if they dislike Kaladin. 

There has been a lot of talk in the pass as to which order would be the best suited for Adolin. A year ago, we found out his Blade belonged to the Edgedancers order. Prior to this revelation, not many people put him within this order: most rooted for the Dustbringers which seems as the right choice, especially since we were still lacking main viewpoint for the order. The fact Brandon did not intend on giving Adolin a major viewpoint never crossed many readers mind as it seemed a no brainier he would get one, eventually. In the end, Edgedancers won but it was hard work to convince people about it, even to this day, I have to skate in the corners to sell the idea to several.

Is Adolin a fantastic proto-Radiant? It is hard to say. I like to believe he is, but then again no spren has chosen him which more or less put a stop to the idea. Even without a broken spirit web, had Adolin been so suitable, then sprens would have investigate him. After all, they investigated the entire Kholin family. The sentient you get others feel Adolin is strong proto-Radiant material merely is a reaction to several readers strong desire to see him become one. There is also the fact Adolin is a nice guy, generous, selfless and brave: on paper he seems to be everything an ancient orders of knights responsible for protecting humanity should be about. It is especially true when you put him side by side with Elhokar. There is a line of thought wanting leaving Adolin out of the Radiants would be a hard sell: why not him? Why everyone else but not him? If this is where his story heads, then the author will have to explain it. If he doesn't, it'd feel like a cheap arc. 

This being said, even if Adolin is superb proto-Edgedancer material does not mean he'll progress faster, especially not faster than Kaladin who is superb Windrunner material. Progression and adhesion to a given order's values aren't necessarily tied: you still need to make your way through the oaths and if Adolin revives his Blade, he'll have to do it without ant help.

4 hours ago, Yata said:

Sorry Maxal but this is (probably) untrue. Shallan has probably spoken their 2 truths as a child and develop Patternblade (It's stupid but I love the name) then she made Pattern flee and their bond almost broke (for the nature of her Order is possible they may develop quite faster in crisis situation....maybe her mum attempt to kill her was a source of a truth, something like "my mother doesn't love me")

In the first book She "thinks" she may summon a Shardblade but she never actual did it (their attempt to summon it made them capable of her fist Soulcast but actually this stop her from the summon). The first time she actually summon Patterblade (after her Shipwreck) and at this point she already told again two truths ("I am scary" and "I killed my father" probably not the exact wording but my book isn't in english) that are equals to the Third Oath for another order.

There is WoB which states the 3rd oath is not the boundary for all orders/Radiants. It has since then been assumed Shallan was one of those as it does appears as if she could summon her Blade prior to having re-said her second truth. I also think all orders progress faster when in a situation of crisis which would explain why Kaladin progresses so fast and Dalinar/Jasnah/Renarin so slowly. Kaladin needed to be a Radiant, now, but the others didn't. They could take their sweet time progressing, there was no urge and no hurry.

Still it may be you are right and she can't. Could she have summoned her Blade back in WoK when she thought of doing it? I guess we are never going to find out.. Isn't there a WoB about it? I may have read something about it, but my memory may serve me wrong.

 

[bdoble97]

1 hour ago, randuir said:

The first part of your question is answered in WoR. As for shardplate, I'll keep that as probably, but RAFO.

Im reading WOR now about 650 pgs in I can't believe how much i forget.