Tor.com Dream casting SA

[bdoble97]

2As most of you, I love SA the two book are just amazing.  So when I saw that Tor had done a article on dream casting WOK I emetaley went to look who they had chosen. I have to say other then the chooses of Wit, Jasnah and Syl  for the main characters extremely dislike the actors chosen. It's not that i don't like some of actors its just they dont even come close to what my minds eyes has created when reading the characters. As some of you have said to me after I  posted the two characters commission I had done of Dalinar Kholin and Kaladin Stormblessed that they were to Caucasian and that Alethi are a mix between caucassian and asian with a middle eastern skin completion. The udea of the Alethi are humans that dont look like any things too simaller to humans on earth is such a cool idea.  With saying all this do people think that when they do the SA movie could they take the actors and do a motion capture/ cgi hybrid and take the existing actress face and morphe it  into a mixture of Caucasian and Asian with a middle eastern skin tone and their characteristics. I dont know if this could be done or even if it would look good. 

[Argent he/him]

I was pretty happy with most of Tor's cast, actually. Dalinar is the only one that didn't work for me.

As for the actual cast, Brandon spoke briefly (on Reddit) about the challengers when casting people who don't look like anything we have on Earth. He said it was not yet decided whether they would go with a more Asian cast for the Alethi (which will be less accurate, but easier to cast) or try to find actors with mixed heritage (who will resemble the Alethi more closely, but will be more difficult to find). 

[Bromo_Sapien]

Ya, I really liked a lot of the casting choices there. It had a nice blend of big names and new faces that fit. The casting of Adolin and Hoid both seemed particularly inspired.

 

I will say, however, I always imagined Dalinar as being broader than they seem to. I love Ken Watanabe and we love to see him find his way to the movie, but I always pictured someone like Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson. He might be a bit young at 44, but Dalinar would have kept himself in peak physical shape while on the Shattered Plains that it fits.

 

Also, while I really like the Rose Leslie casting for Shallan, take a look at Aya Cash. She's fantastic on You're the Worst and has the right blend of arrogance, immaturity, and biting wit to be perfect for Shallan.

[bdoble97]

1 hour ago, Argent said:

I was pretty happy with most of Tor's cast, actually. Dalinar is the only one that didn't work for me.

As for the actual cast, Brandon spoke briefly (on Reddit) about the challengers when casting people who don't look like anything we have on Earth. He said it was not yet decided whether they would go with a more Asian cast for the Alethi (which will be less accurate, but easier to cast) or try to find actors with mixed heritage (who will resemble the Alethi more closely, but will be more difficult to find). 

I lovw the I love the actual actor they chose for Dalinar he was amazing in The Last Samurai. But he looks nothing like the Dalinar I have created in my minds eye that I had commissioned as well. With Brandon saying the difficulty of casting people to play characters that look nothig like people on her that's why I bring up the motion-capture / CGI idea of crafting a face on top of the actress face that can create what Brandon pictures the characters to look like. 

[bdoble97]

@Argent what would you think of tbis Dalinar with a blend of Ken Watanab

[Argent he/him]

Uh, hard to tell. Maybe? Both your commission and Tor's casting understate his bulk (as I imagine it). 

[bdoble97]

O man! @Argent I want to have the artis to do a Dalinar blending William Hurt and Ken Watanab but juat make him bigger. But I really want to have him the artist do Adolin next in his uniform talking to his sharddlade and then in full shardplate.

[Eki]

I thought most of them were okay... As others have said, I think Dalinar should be more powerfully built, and it would be odd for Jasnah to not have epicanthic folds if both her mother and uncle do (of course, it would be weird if she didn't have them regardless, but at least I understand their reasoning for (some) Jah Kavedians not to have them).

[WeiryWriter he/him]

As a point of fact Brandon has never, to my knowledge, described the Alethi as being half-Asian half-Caucasian. That would describe Vedens like Shallan. The model Brandon is using for the Alethi are half-Asian half-Hawaiian.

[bdoble97]

15 minutes ago, WeiryWriter said:

As a point of fact Brandon has never, to my knowledge, described the Alethi as being half-Asian half-Caucasian. That would describe Vedens like Shallan. The model Brandon is using for the Alethi are half-Asian half-Hawaiian.

Hmm I must have made up the half asian half Caucasian my fault sorry. I just been reading so much stuff that maybe it was someone's comment I don't know. So if it half asian half Hawaiian that badass hahah that made me instantly think of Junior Seau as a huge New England Patriots fan I loved that guy correct me if I'm wrong what he was Hawaiian. Who would you like to see play The Blackthorn Dalinar Kholin 

[maxal she/her]

I saw the casting: I have enjoyed most of it. I disliked Dalinar because I feel he should have a stronger built. I also dislike Adolin because I mean, the chosen actor isn't blond. I am not a huge fan of blond wigs or dye over jet black hair, so I would have preferred if they had went outside the Asian world for him.

I didn't understand the casting for Sadeas.

[nervousnerd he/him]

I will say that I am happy to see a lot of asian actors on the list. I do think that while it would be nice to get actors exactly as what Brandon imagined, it will be harder and more limiting. CGI changing of races is a complicated issue, particularly when they are races that actually exist (not normal fantasy races). I also would kind of prefer they go with some lesser known actors for a lot of parts because I feel like they will be more likely to stick with the series that way. As for the actual actors mentioned, some thoughts:

• Szeth is going to be hard. I have always pictured him like Aang from Avatar. I think it should be someone fairly young.
• I guess I always just pictured Dalinar as more muscular and imposing. Perhaps it is the shardplate. Not to say that the actors couldn't bulk up I suppose.
• I really picture Navani being older. I suppose Lucy Liu is even around the right age but she looks so young to me.
• Sadeas has to look more evil to me. Maybe that will be more about attitude but I kind of want him to look evil from the start. We need to expect the whole evil guy turns out to be good trope to get the most out of his betrayal.
• I could see Hoid being played like Tom Hiddleston played Loki but I do wonder about the size of the part. You really want someone who is willing to be the Stan Lee of the cosmere (with better acting hopefully).
• I can't see Bautista being able to do accents well. He is fine when he plays more to himself. It might be better to get someone with an accent as opposed to having them do one. It will kind of detract from the character if the funny part of him is the accent instead of his customs.
• Rose Leslie is pretty much how I picture Shallan looking but I'm not sure how much she could match the personality. I have only seen her in two things though so I could be wrong. Awkwardness is not always easy to portray (although some of us are just naturally gifted).
• Mark Shepperd has the Gaz personality down easy. I'm not sure about appearance but apparent he is from near Jah Kaved so it might make sense for him to appear of a different race.
• Pedro Pascal could play any of these characters (male or female) and I'd be fine with it.

I think the other big question is what accent will they speak in? Will they go British or more American?

Edited November 4, 2016 by nervousnerd

[Toaster Retribution he/him]

Like the choices for pretty much everyone. 

I can buy the guy they chose for Dalinar. I have never seen Watanabe in anything, as far as I know, but I am pretty sure he has done a bunch of physical roles and could buff up a bit through training.

Hoid though... Hiddelston would be a great fit for the character, but I'm thinking David Tennant maybe? As a reserve. The one negative thing is that Hiddelston might overshadow the Hoid role since he is Loki in so many peoples eyes.

[bdoble97]

2 hours ago, Chull #445 said:

Like the choices for pretty much everyone. 

I can buy the guy they chose for Dalinar. I have never seen Watanabe in anything, as far as I know, but I am pretty sure he has done a bunch of physical roles and could buff up a bit through training.

Hoid though... Hiddelston would be a great fit for the character, but I'm thinking David Tennant maybe? As a reserve. The one negative thing is that Hiddelston might overshadow the Hoid role since he is Loki in so many peoples eyes.

Watanab was so good in The Last Samurai.  Only other thing that definitely know that I saw him in was one the Pirates of the Caribbean movies. Did not like his character in that movie.  I think Hiddelston would be a excellent choice for Wit/Hoid. I am reading Warbraker right now and loved Hoid as the stoey teller. I'm not done with Warbraker am hopping he has another scean in the book. 

[startreklord06]

I am fine with all of their choices. I always imagined Felicia Day as Shallan

[Rhaegar'Elin he/him]

- I don't know, though I really like Rose Leslie, I would like a slightly younger version of Shallan: for me, Annalise Basso would be perfect for the part.

- I liked Watanabe in The Last Samurai (but also in Inception) and he could be a great Dalinar... but I have always imagined the Highprince more imposing and well built than him, so I'm not really convinced by this choice.

- The rest of the main charcters seems OK to me and, as a side note, I really like Lucy Liu as Navani

 

Edited November 6, 2016 by Rhaegar'Elin

[Iarwainiel I she/her]

What about actors from the Philippines? (Are there any?) Their heritage might be similar to what many of you are thinking re: Alethi.

That said, even if the production company "fast tracks" the movies, it could well be 5 years or more before we see anything in the theaters - point being, all the actors we're discussing might be tool old for these roles by the time they actually film. Yeah, I know they call it "dream-casting" for a reason. ;-)

I know a bunch of people who would enjoy Brandon's stories SOOOO much, but they simply will not read or even do audio books. It would make me super-happy if movies gave them a path into the Cosmere. For myself, though ... I would probably not go to see any of these movies, preferring to keep my experience of the Sander-verse in the written format to preserve what the settings and characters look like in my own mind. (I have never seen any of TLotR/Hobbit movies, or even looked at production photos, and I do not intend to do so - 18+ times through the books is fine for me.) Please understand that I'm only speaking for myself. I'm very happy for others' enjoyment and I'm solidly in favor of widening the fanbase via films/TV and will encourage everyone I know to attend.

Question for the group: You don't think that Brandon will let the narrative in the movies get "ahead" of what's in the books, do you? - like GRR Martin is supposedly doing with Game of Thrones? I can totally get how the plots might diverge. between the 2 mediums, but I really hope Brandon always does the books first. I remember how Straczynski's "Babylon 5" story arc kept getting changed because of production challenges, casting problems, etc. I'd hate to see the Cosmere epic modified or controlled by anything other than Brandon's imagination, and IMO books are the only way that can be 100% assured.

[maxal she/her]

51 minutes ago, old aggie said:

What about actors from the Philippines? (Are there any?) Their heritage might be similar to what many of you are thinking re: Alethi.

That said, even if the production company "fast tracks" the movies, it could well be 5 years or more before we see anything in the theaters - point being, all the actors we're discussing might be tool old for these roles by the time they actually film. Yeah, I know they call it "dream-casting" for a reason. ;-)

I know a bunch of people who would enjoy Brandon's stories SOOOO much, but they simply will not read or even do audio books. It would make me super-happy if movies gave them a path into the Cosmere. For myself, though ... I would probably not go to see any of these movies, preferring to keep my experience of the Sander-verse in the written format to preserve what the settings and characters look like in my own mind. (I have never seen any of TLotR/Hobbit movies, or even looked at production photos, and I do not intend to do so - 18+ times through the books is fine for me.) Please understand that I'm only speaking for myself. I'm very happy for others' enjoyment and I'm solidly in favor of widening the fanbase via films/TV and will encourage everyone I know to attend.

Question for the group: You don't think that Brandon will let the narrative in the movies get "ahead" of what's in the books, do you? - like GRR Martin is supposedly doing with Game of Thrones? I can totally get how the plots might diverge. between the 2 mediums, but I really hope Brandon always does the books first. I remember how Straczynski's "Babylon 5" story arc kept getting changed because of production challenges, casting problems, etc. I'd hate to see the Cosmere epic modified or controlled by anything other than Brandon's imagination, and IMO books are the only way that can be 100% assured.

There are several choices when it comes to the ethnicity of Alethi: Asian being one of them. We however have to take into consideration the production will need a large pool of actors to pick from, so going too specific might make the casting difficult. Besides, what we want above all are good actors, not actors chosen merely because they have precisely the right heritage mix. 

As for the movie, I understand your viewpoint and I respect it. While not sharing exactly your disposition I do currently sit in a position where I fear the casting might ruin my personal imagery. I disagree with several choices and I would rather keep my own vision. I would therefore eventually need to decide if the movie is something I really want to see, if it might be a visual support to enhance my enjoyment of the Stormlight Archive or if it will temper it down. Both are possible and I just cannot know how I'll feel about everything once we get the first screen shootings.

[HoidvsVoid]

The thing i look forward to the most is brandon saying WAFO.

[Cryptnoch]

there are the WoR sketches, I suspect they are Brandon approved, anyways. the Alethi one appears to be definitely caucasian at least in structure. I think it would make sense that these do in fact fit his imagined race seeing as the fact that the subject of the drawing was specifically declare to be Alethi. 

http://brandonsanderson.com/books/the-stormlight-archive/words-of-radiance/stormlight-2-maps-and-illustrations/

I disagree with the choice for Kaladin. if the other alethi (unless he isn't alethi at all) are so asianish then why does he have such a drastically different complexion? the way the races on Roshar are described suggests that they're fairly constant with regards to morphology. 
Additionally disagree with Dalinar, and feel a tad iffy about Shallan. all the others I find spot-on, however. 

Sorry if I misunderstood something. 

[Eki]

21 minutes ago, Cryptnoch said:

there are the WoR sketches, I suspect they are Brandon approved, anyways. the Alethi one appears to be definitely caucasian at least in structure. I think it would make sense that these do in fact fit his imagined race seeing as the fact that the subject of the drawing was specifically declare to be Alethi. 

http://brandonsanderson.com/books/the-stormlight-archive/words-of-radiance/stormlight-2-maps-and-illustrations/

I disagree with the choice for Kaladin. if the other alethi (unless he isn't alethi at all) are so asianish then why does he have such a drastically different complexion? the way the races on Roshar are described suggests that they're fairly constant with regards to morphology. 
Additionally disagree with Dalinar, and feel a tad iffy about Shallan. all the others I find spot-on, however. 

Sorry if I misunderstood something. 

Brandon has elaborated on Rosharan races here. The tl;dr on how Alethi are described is that they themselves don't care much about skin color, as they focus more on the eyes and hair. But there are differences.

[maxal she/her]

For my part, I have observed a cleavage in between how most readers have portrayed the characters, based on the book descriptions, and how the initiators of this casting have portrayed them. Of course, since Alethi aren't a known ethnicity on Earth, you have to make compromises, but I disagree with the ones they chose to make. I also fail to understand their logic.

For instance, they chose to portray Sadeas as a white actor based over the fact he is described as having curly hair and a red face. Based on this description, "white" does make sense, but elsewhere, they insisted on Alethi being 100% Asian despite the fact it clashes with other book descriptions. For instances, Adolin is described as blond haired, blue eyed and only half-Alethi, but they ignore it to focus on the more "politically correct" choice of an Asian actor. It isn't I have anything against this specific actor, but he has nothing in common with book Adolin's physics besides the eyes. You would think, if it was important/crucial to maintain the cast Asian at all cost, if it was perfectly reasonable to ignore Adolin's hair coloring, then why isn't it important when it comes to casting Sadeas? And Shallan? Why is it essential to cast Adolin purely based on his eye shapes, but it is perfectly fine to ignore Shallan based on the fact she is Veden and not Alethi? Did I also mention Jasnah who is portrayed by a South-American actress? Therefore, if Asian is not the most important criteria, as initially assumed, then explain Adolin and Dalinar's casting... both chosen actors do not resemble their book counter-part. Their reasoning is thus not coherent with itself and it allows Adolin to be badly cast for no apparent valid reason. Their Dalinar also doesn't have the right physical built.

My thoughts are thus focusing solely on Western Asian to make the core of the cast is too restrictive when it comes to finding actors able to embodied the book descriptions of the characters and how most readers have come to view them. I thus think Arabs/Eastern Asians would be preferable as it would allow more flexibility in finding actors with closer to the book descriptions of the characters. Both those representations are inline with Brandon's comments on how the characters would look to us.

So huh while they did put up a lot of work and they did come up with good suggestions, they completely missed it for others. 

[Argent he/him]

Eeehhh, I think that may be overanalyzing it, @maxal. In my experience most people don't look at the details of every character's description, they go with what feels right with the image they have in their head. Often it can be about the vibe of the actor.

[Tharatariel10 she/her]

Tom Hiddleston has been Hoid in my mind almost from the beginning, with Paul Bettany being a close runner up!! AUGH! If anything comes true I hope it's that!!!

I understand the Asian casting, but I always pictured the Alethi much more Middle Eastern.  It is in their ethnicity that you get the dark skin and hair but a variety of eye colors.  Think of the famous NG girl from all those years ago: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_Girl#/media/File:Sharbat_Gula.jpg 

To me, that's the lighteyes/dark features look that the books suggested.  Just my few cents...

[bdoble97]

1 hour ago, Tharatariel10 said:

Tom Hiddleston has been Hoid in my mind almost from the beginning, with Paul Bettany being a close runner up!! AUGH! If anything comes true I hope it's that!!!

I understand the Asian casting, but I always pictured the Alethi much more Middle Eastern.  It is in their ethnicity that you get the dark skin and hair but a variety of eye colors.  Think of the famous NG girl from all those years ago: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_Girl#/media/File:Sharbat_Gula.jpg 

To me, that's the lighteyes/dark features look that the books suggested.  Just my few cents...

Thats perfect.