The Art of Game Creation

[Elbereth she/her]

@Abstrusity the next game is up! Have fun in QF41!

[Darkness Ascendant he/him]

We should make an SE: Battle Royale

[Straw he/him]

46 minutes ago, Darkness Ascendant said:

We should make an SE: Battle Royale

Look at the Hunger Games QF or Stink's Pokemon QF.

[Darkness Ascendant he/him]

5 hours ago, Straw said:

Look at the Hunger Games QF or Stink's Pokemon QF.

No we need fortnite

 

[The Young Pyromancer he/him]

And the game must last two weeks.

[Abstrusity]

Speak not of that accursed cutlery game! Fork-knife is a disease upon this land.

[Kidpen he/him]

Pretty random question: What are the reasons that pretty much every game with PMs disallows group PMs? Is it just because that would be too many PMs, or is there another reason? I have a game that only kind of exists in my mind, but if I ever ran it it would depend heavily on group PMs.

[Alvron he/him]

1 hour ago, Kidpen said:

Pretty random question: What are the reasons that pretty much every game with PMs disallows group PMs? Is it just because that would be too many PMs, or is there another reason? I have a game that only kind of exists in my mind, but if I ever ran it it would depend heavily on group PMs.

Mostly it comes down to the mechanics.  For instance if you have a game that uses Spanreeds then it wouldn't make sense to have group PMs due to Spanreeds only being one on one in world.
There could also be a PM spying role, which is fairly rare, so a group PM would be quite the pain to have in game.
Other times GMs don't want a large group forming and sharing information so easily.  In past the community has disapproved of trust groups forming as it can marginalize those playing but not in the group by not giving them an equal or fair say.  If one person asks you to do something you can always say no but it a group of trusted villagers ask you to do something and you don't want to, it can lead to issues.  I wouldn't be surprised if the anti-trust group mentality has seeped into the GMs thinking when making a game and they subconsciously went away from group PMs.

There is no reason for your game not to have group PMs.  No one is going to complain that they can talk to others.

[StrikerEZ he/him]

@Alvron @Twibanu I really like having PMs, especially group PMs. I understand why you would take them out for balance (or if it’s Roshar-flavored with the Spanreeds), but it just makes me sad when PMs are limited in any way.

[Elkanah he/him]

The God King and I have been discussing ideas for an Ashyn game. Where do we go to get on a wait list and who can we contact to make sure our game is balanced? I'd post more in here, but we were thinking of dong a semi-blackout game.

[Elandera she/her]

4 hours ago, Elkanah said:

The God King and I have been discussing ideas for an Ashyn game. Where do we go to get on a wait list and who can we contact to make sure our game is balanced? I'd post more in here, but we were thinking of dong a semi-blackout game.

For a semi-blackout, you can send the rules to the balance committee (myself, Amanuensis, STINK, Araris Valerian, and Sart are among them). What style of game is it, MR, LG, or QF? That will change which list you're placed on. 

You can also post the non-blackout part of the rules in this thread for anyone to give feedback on. It also helps people know what games to look forward to.

[Elkanah he/him]

We are looking at doing a game where 17th sharders from silverlight come to Ashyn to try to determine more about how investiture works. Some local incubators stow away and are trying to kill the 17th Sharders to prevent others knowing about how power works on Ashyn. 

The village will be the 17th Shard

The elims will be the Incubators

It would be a long game

The abilities would be based on the Ashyn magic system

Incidentally, have we had an Ashyn game so we can see what has been done in the past?

That's all I'll say for now. @The_God_King might elaborate more, but I don't want to say too much at this point.

[The_God_King]

Here is the write up that would be the public information available to the player. I would appreciate thoughts

 

 

Contains spoilers for… everything! Takes place before the first Mistborn Trilogy 

 

The streets of Silverlight shone with ethereal light. Dust clung to the boots of the researchers as they walked to the university. Samples filled their packs and journals brimmed with accounts of floating cities and investiture being used by the most mundane creature. Their work had finally finished after nearly two years of being away from home.

The projects of these researchers had gone phenomenally! The researchers had scattered across the Ashyn to collect anything that could help their research. Their samples would further the knowledge of the Shard by decades! With their work concluded the researchers returned to their homes to recover from their journeys. Now the interns needed to sort through the data. 

Little did the researchers know that they were being watched. While the Shard had studied Ashyn, Ashyn had studied the Shard. Slowly and surely they had implanted people into Silverlight and a few had made it into the university. While the researchers were highly vetted, the interns were only given a cursory check. 

Strange things happened with the study: samples went missing, fires destroyed important files, and an intern suspiciously died. The study needed to continue, but the interns were wary of the others. The various worlds they had come from would make it hard for the other interns to pin who was lying. 

Find the Ashyn infiltrators, continue the study, and find the secrets of investiture

[Sart he/him]

So I was watching a let's play of a Japanese horror game, and realized that the death game featured in it is basically Mafia, with a couple of neat twists. So, I figure I should adapt the game into a game for us to play. Here is a link to the original game. Warning: The game is very bloody and gore filled. Viewer discretion is advised.

Your Turn To Die (QF Edition):

Synopsis: You have become trapped in an insane death game for unknown reasons. Will you survive long enough to escape, or will you be forced to betray the other participants? In the end, it all comes down to a majority vote.

Basic Gameplay:

• The game is played in 48 hour cycles, broken up into two 24 hour phases.
• Every cycle, there is a 24 hour Nomination Phase, where candidates are selected, and a 24 hour Voting Phase, where one of the candidates is brutally killed.
• Everyone's win condition is the same: Escape the killing game. After a certain number of cycles (dependent on player count) all survivors will escape.
• At the start of every Cycle, the Roles will be redistributed among all living players.
• There are four Roles: Commoner, Keymaster, Sage, and Sacrifice
  • There will be one Keymaster, Sage, and Sacrifice during each cycle. All other players will be Commoners.
• All voting during the game is anonymous. In your character PM, send the GM your vote. If you vote in the thread, it will be counted, but if you vote in thread, and have a different vote in your PM, the PM vote takes precedence.

Phases:

• Nomination Phase: Vote for any player to be a candidate in the Voting Phase.
  • At maximum, half of the living players, rounded down, will be selected as candidates.
  • Players with the most votes will be selected as candidates first.
  • If you have 0 votes, you will not be a candidate.
  • Ties will be decided randomly.
  • For instance, if A had 4 votes, B had 1 vote, C had 1 vote, D had 0 votes, and E had 0 votes, A would definitely be a candidate, and one of B or C would be another candidate. If A had all the votes, only A would be a candidate.
• Voting Phase: Vote for one candidate to brutally execute.
  • Both candidates and non-candidates get to vote.
  • Only candidates can be voted on. Non-candidates are safe.
  • In the previous example, if B won the coin flip, only A and C would be eligible for the lynch.

Roles:

• Commoner:
  • Commoners have no special powers.
  • If a Commoner is lynched, they die along with the Sacrifice.
  • If two or more Commoners are tied for the lynch, the result will be decided randomly.
• Keymaster:
  • If the Keymaster is lynched, all players die.
  • If the Keymaster is tied for the lynch with any other role, all players die
• Sage:
  • At the start of the Nomination phase, the Sage is told who the Keymaster is.
  • The Sage cannot lie regarding the identity of the Keymaster.
    • They can, of course, choose to keep silent about their information.
  • If the Sage is lynched, they die along with the Sacrifice.
    • If the Sage and a Commoner are tied for the lynch, the Sage will be lynched.
• Sacrifice:
  • The Sacrifice is forced to betray the other participants in order to escape the killing game.
  • If the Sacrifice is not lynched, they die.
  • If the Sacrifice is lynched, they choose one other person. The Sacrifice and the person they chose escape the killing game, but all other players die.
    • If the Sacrifice is tied with a Commoner or the Sage, the Sacrifice takes precedence.
    • If the Sacrifice is tied with the Keymaster, the Keymaster takes precedence.
  • The Sacrifice has two votes during the Nomination and Voting phases. They can divide them or put them on the same person.

[StrikerEZ he/him]

3 hours ago, Sart said:

So I was watching a let's play of a Japanese horror game, and realized that the death game featured in it is basically Mafia, with a couple of neat twists. So, I figure I should adapt the game into a game for us to play. Here is a link to the original game. Warning: The game is very bloody and gore filled. Viewer discretion is advised.

Your Turn To Die (QF Edition):

Synopsis: You have become trapped in an insane death game for unknown reasons. Will you survive long enough to escape, or will you be forced to betray the other participants? In the end, it all comes down to a majority vote.

Basic Gameplay:

• The game is played in 48 hour cycles, broken up into two 24 hour phases.
• Every cycle, there is a 24 hour Nomination Phase, where candidates are selected, and a 24 hour Voting Phase, where one of the candidates is brutally killed.
• Everyone's win condition is the same: Escape the killing game. After a certain number of cycles (dependent on player count) all survivors will escape.
• At the start of every Cycle, the Roles will be redistributed among all living players.
• There are four Roles: Commoner, Keymaster, Sage, and Sacrifice
  • There will be one Keymaster, Sage, and Sacrifice during each cycle. All other players will be Commoners.
• All voting during the game is anonymous. In your character PM, send the GM your vote. If you vote in the thread, it will be counted, but if you vote in thread, and have a different vote in your PM, the PM vote takes precedence.

Phases:

• Nomination Phase: Vote for any player to be a candidate in the Voting Phase.
  • At maximum, half of the living players, rounded down, will be selected as candidates.
  • Players with the most votes will be selected as candidates first.
  • If you have 0 votes, you will not be a candidate.
  • Ties will be decided randomly.
  • For instance, if A had 4 votes, B had 1 vote, C had 1 vote, D had 0 votes, and E had 0 votes, A would definitely be a candidate, and one of B or C would be another candidate. If A had all the votes, only A would be a candidate.
• Voting Phase: Vote for one candidate to brutally execute.
  • Both candidates and non-candidates get to vote.
  • Only candidates can be voted on. Non-candidates are safe.
  • In the previous example, if B won the coin flip, only A and C would be eligible for the lynch.

Roles:

• Commoner:
  • Commoners have no special powers.
  • If a Commoner is lynched, they die along with the Sacrifice.
  • If two or more Commoners are tied for the lynch, the result will be decided randomly.
• Keymaster:
  • If the Keymaster is lynched, all players die.
  • If the Keymaster is tied for the lynch with any other role, all players die
• Sage:
  • At the start of the Nomination phase, the Sage is told who the Keymaster is.
  • The Sage cannot lie regarding the identity of the Keymaster.
    • They can, of course, choose to keep silent about their information.
  • If the Sage is lynched, they die along with the Sacrifice.
    • If the Sage and a Commoner are tied for the lynch, the Sage will be lynched.
• Sacrifice:
  • The Sacrifice is forced to betray the other participants in order to escape the killing game.
  • If the Sacrifice is not lynched, they die.
  • If the Sacrifice is lynched, they choose one other person. The Sacrifice and the person they chose escape the killing game, but all other players die.
    • If the Sacrifice is tied with a Commoner or the Sage, the Sacrifice takes precedence.
    • If the Sacrifice is tied with the Keymaster, the Keymaster takes precedence.
  • The Sacrifice has two votes during the Nomination and Voting phases. They can divide them or put them on the same person.

@Arraenae@Burnt Spaghetti If either of you are still looking for a non-Sanderson game...you could pick this one. I've already got a plan for one, but if neither of you can do this one...I might have to.

[Experience he/him]

So I've been making a game I would like to GM, but I really haven't played this for that long and I don't know if everything is balanced. I would just post it into this thread, but it's a blackout game, so I'm not sure what to do. 

Edited March 27, 2020 by EXPERIENCE
typo

[Elkanah he/him]

22 minutes ago, EXPERIENCE said:

So I've been making a game I would like to GM, but I really haven't played this for that long and I don't know if everything is balanced. I would just post it into this thread, but it's a blackout game, so I'm not sure what to do. 

I recommend sending a link of the rules to the rules committee.

On 3/8/2020 at 4:14 AM, Elandera said:

For a semi-blackout, you can send the rules to the balance committee (myself, Amanuensis, STINK, Araris Valerian, and Sart are among them). What style of game is it, MR, LG, or QF? That will change which list you're placed on. 

You can also post the non-blackout part of the rules in this thread for anyone to give feedback on. It also helps people know what games to look forward to.

This.

 

Also, it might be good to get a co-gm who has run several games.

[Experience he/him]

Ok, thank you.

[Straw he/him]

1 hour ago, EXPERIENCE said:

So I've been making a game I would like to GM, but I really haven't played this for that long and I don't know if everything is balanced. I would just post it into this thread, but it's a blackout game, so I'm not sure what to do. 

It doesn't look like you're on the list of upcoming GMs, so you might want to ask someone to add you.

Also, I would not recommend running a blackout as your first game, as they tend to be more difficult to balance.

[Experience he/him]

Yes. I am thinking of possibly just making it non blackout.  

[Experience he/him]

Ok. I changed a few thing around. Here it is:

 

First of the Sun MR:

You are a group of adventurers on Patji who have traitors in your midst. The Traitorous Trappers need to equal the number of Trappers to win. The Trappers need to eliminate all of the Traitorous Trappers to win. 

Aviar(Roles):

Killer: You know that the only way to eliminate the traitors is to take matters into your own hands. Your Aviar gives you the strength to kill. (Each night you can kill one person).[Activates Traps]

Healer: Your Aviar gives you the knowledge to heal all but the most deadly of wounds. (each night you can protect one person from death. You cannot protect yourself two nights in a row. If someone is attacked by a Nightmaw, then your protection fails.)

Spy: Your Aviar gifts you with stealthiness letting you spy on the other Trappers. (Each night, you can check one person's alignment)[Activates Traps]

Good-looking: Your Aviar looks amazing and gives you the gift to look good as well.(If you are spied on, then you will appear as a Trapper. If your Aviar is spied on, then they appear as a Hidden Aviar)

Hidden: Your Aviar hides your mind from predators. (If the Nightmaw attacks you, you don’t die)

Messenger Your Aviar allows you to speak in somebody's mind for a short period of time. (During the night you can set up one PM with one other player. Must include GM(s). After night ends, you are not allowed to talk in the PM anymore)[Activates Traps]

Aviar Killer You know that without their Aviar, the traitors will be greatly weakened. Your Aviar gives you the ability to trap Aviar(Each night you can choose to kill one players Aviar)[Activates Traps]

Aviar Spy Your Aviar gives you the power to know other Aviar’s gifts. (Each night you can choose one person and you learn their Aviar's power)[Activates Traps]

Experience:

Supreme - 5%

Master - 9%

Apprentice - 13%

Amatuer - 17%

Events:

• Nightmaw attacks(The nights when 25%(rounded down) and 50%(rounded down) of the starting number of players have died, a Nightmaw attacks 1 random person). 

• Traps(If a person uses an Aviar power that Activates Traps then the percent of their experience is used. Whatever the percent is, whenever you encounter a trap you have that percent chance of dying.) Healers can protect you from traps. Each time that you encounter a trap and survive, you become more experienced and your experience percent decreases by 1(to a minimum of 1). 

 

Order of actions:

Traps

Aviar Spy & spy

Heal

Maf kill & town kill & aviar kill & nightmaw attack

Messenger

Other Things:

• A tie lynch vote is randomly chosen
• No PM's allowed except with the messenger
• Players submit their role actions through their GM PM.
• Traps are something that are there at the beginning of the game. You don't place them. Whenever you use an action that encounters a trap, or a maf attacks, then you have your experience percent chance of dying.  

Edited March 28, 2020 by EXPERIENCE
Changes nightmaws, order of actions, experience, making spies and healers not faction specific roles

[Straw he/him]

Is there any way to change experience? Also, those experience levels seem really close to each other. Maybe consider having a more noticeable gap?

Also, I don't feel like the Nightmaw attack being completely random is very fair. If it's a close game, that one kill could make the difference between a win and a loss. Maybe connect them to the traps somehow?

[Experience he/him]

16 minutes ago, Straw said:

Is there any way to change experience? Also, those experience levels seem really close to each other. Maybe consider having a more noticeable gap?

Also, I don't feel like the Nightmaw attack being completely random is very fair. If it's a close game, that one kill could make the difference between a win and a loss. Maybe connect them to the traps somehow?

So, at the moment experience doesn't change. I can make them more spread out though.

I will edit in the changes. What do you think the nightmaw attack should be connected to? If it's connected to traps, then the Aviar that hides you is kinda useless.

Edited March 27, 2020 by EXPERIENCE
grammer

[Experience he/him]

I changed the Nightmaws to only attack at 25% and 50% of players, so that it won't effect the late game as much. I also made it so that experience can change.

Edited March 27, 2020 by EXPERIENCE

[Elbereth she/her]

Ooh, ooh, a First of the Sun game! Fantastic! 

8 hours ago, EXPERIENCE said:

Killer: You know that the only way to eliminate the traitors is to take matters into your own hands. Your Aviar gives you the strength to kill. (Each night you can kill one person).[Activates Traps]

Healer: Your Aviar gives you the knowledge to heal all but the most deadly of wounds. (each night you can protect one person from death. You cannot protect yourself two nights in a row. If someone is attacked by a Nightmaw, then your protection fails.)

Spy: Your Aviar gifts you with stealthiness letting you spy on the other Trappers. (Each night, you can check one person's alignment)[Activates Traps]

I'm going to assume that the green color of these roles means they're always villagers. This is generally not ideal. 

Scenario: I'm a killer. I'm going to take a gamble and assume there's at least one healer in the game. Therefore, I claim in thread the first cycle, asking to be protected. This makes me an effectively guaranteed villager, since I can say "X will be killed" and then that happens. Because the healer can protect me every cycle, the eliminators can't kill me despite me being a significant threat to them (probably. Not all kill roles are equally successful), and meanwhile because I'm a confirmed villager everyone trusts and listens to me. Especially if I'm a player known to be "experienced" or "good" or whatever y'all are calling it nowadays. This is frustrating to the elims, and the village plays follow-the-leader instead of doing their own analysis. 

Scenario: I'm an Aviar Spy. Despite being a role-scanner, if I scan any of these three roles I can be absolutely certain they're good. The lack of PMs being open helps, significantly, in that there isn't an instant trust circle. But if I'm in contact with a PM person, I can indirectly tell any healer I scan to protect X other good role. Or tell a killer not to kill X other people because they're healers or spies. Etc. It makes the village much, much more accurate - and unlike the Spy, my role is verifiable. Elims can mimic alignment scanners fine, role scanners not so much. And that's even more helpful than a Spy, since I can't be fooled by Good-Looking Aviar. 

Basically, what I'm saying is: I know it makes sense for these three roles to all be village. And sure, you probably won't give the elims a kill. But you could absolutely give them a healer or spy just to trip up an Aviar Spy, for instance - and even if you don't it's always a possibility. But any roles which are confirmed to be a specific faction have historically not been great for the game as a whole in one way or another. 

8 hours ago, EXPERIENCE said:

Nightmaw attacks(The nights when 25%(rounded down) and 50%(rounded down) of the starting number of players have died, a Nightmaw attacks 1 random person). 

Okay, I have a slightly different question than Straw here. What's the point of this role? Traps have a purpose: they make powerful roles more risky to use, so players have to choose whether their target is worth the risk. But this is two arbitrary deaths that may affect the balance of the game for reasons entirely outside the players' control. So it's an interesting flavor, but as a game mechanic it's not something the players can interact with, change, or strategize around. 

 

8 hours ago, EXPERIENCE said:

Traps(If a person uses an Aviar power that Activates Traps then the percent of their experience is used. Whatever the percent is, whenever you encounter a trap you have that percent chance of dying.) Healers can protect you from traps. Each time that you encounter a trap and survive, you become more experienced and your experience percent decreases by 1(to a minimum of 1). 

Does the player know their experience level?