Hoids awareness

[Nightblade]

I was re-reading the WoK and the scene where Kaladin first meets Hoid really stuck out to me. 

[ ''And what is your name, my thoughtful bridgeman? Kaladin hesitantly raised his own hand. ''Kaladin. And yours?'' "I've many.'' The man shook Kaladin's hand. "I began life as a thought, a concept, words on a page. That was another thing I stole. Myself.] - Chapter 57 "Wandersail" 

It seems to me that Hoid is aware that he is a fictional character.

 

[The Ninja Yodeler he/him]

So what you're saying is... Hoid is Deadpool!

[Nightblade]

14 minutes ago, The Ninja Yodeler said:

So what you're saying is... Hoid is Deadpool!

Yes! I had recently heard that deadpool was aware like that>

[bdoble97]

Makes me think Hoid knows the being that created the cosmere and himself. 

[Jondesu he/him]

1 hour ago, bdoble97 said:

Makes me think Hoid knows the being that created the cosmere and himself. 

So, Brandon? 

[bdoble97]

6 hours ago, Jondesu said:

So, Brandon? 

Hahaha yea. 

[Savanorn he/him]

Maybe. But I think it is more than that. I think Hoid might actually be some sort of human construct given a few quirks of his nature (being maybe spiritually blind, unable to hurt living people). 

It might be a meta reference, but I think there's more than that.

[Yata he/him]

11 hours ago, Savanorn said:

Maybe. But I think it is more than that. I think Hoid might actually be some sort of human construct given a few quirks of his nature (being maybe spiritually blind, unable to hurt living people). 

It might be a meta reference, but I think there's more than that.

But we know that Hoid was born like everyone else and he was originally Human. Now is something different in the same way that Humans deeply twisted by Investiture are no more properly Humans

 

[Bromo_Sapien]

He also literally met a capital-G God, someone who literally created everything (including humans, i.e. him originally). I wonder if Adonalsium was somehow suppressing individuality and that Hoid et al "stole" that when they killed him. I generally think of A as a benign God, but considering Odium and Ruin came out of him, perhaps that's a bit naive.

 

Spitballing a theory here that I probably should develop while not at work: if A was a living Pandora's Box, containing the sixteen Shards away from humanity (to use a general term representing all sentient life). That would explain Hoid's comment of stealing himself, since the Shards compose most of what defines a personality. Purely a braindump that came from this topic; I'll look more into it when I'm home later, see if I can garner more evidence...

[1stBondsmith he/him]

Remember that Adonalsium had 16 Intents. A God Is Autonomous of all other powers. God Cultivates his creations. God punishes and Hates those who do not obey laws. God Always keeps his word Honorably, etc. God establishes change (Ruin) and progression. He is mighty to save (Preservation). Just like Ruin balances Preservation and many other things, an all-powerful God would have all those intents in a perfect balance and used appropriately. I do not think they were kept from humanity, but were used for them.

[Savanorn he/him]

On Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 10:08 PM, Yata said:

But we know that Hoid was born like everyone else and he was originally Human. Now is something different in the same way that Humans deeply twisted by Investiture are no more properly Humans

 

Ah shoot. I presume this is based on WoB I haven't read.

 

[Spoolofwhool]

6 hours ago, Bromo_Sapien said:

He also literally met a capital-G God, someone who literally created everything (including humans, i.e. him originally). I wonder if Adonalsium was somehow suppressing individuality and that Hoid et al "stole" that when they killed him. I generally think of A as a benign God, but considering Odium and Ruin came out of him, perhaps that's a bit naive.

 

Spitballing a theory here that I probably should develop while not at work: if A was a living Pandora's Box, containing the sixteen Shards away from humanity (to use a general term representing all sentient life). That would explain Hoid's comment of stealing himself, since the Shards compose most of what defines a personality. Purely a braindump that came from this topic; I'll look more into it when I'm home later, see if I can garner more evidence...

Don't forget that the 16 shards which currently exist are not the only way that Adonalsium could'be shattered. WoB seems to be implying that there could've been other intents which had resulted, and that other attributes could've been imbued into the shards instead of those currently in existence.

 

[Bromo_Sapien]

12 hours ago, Spoolofwhool said:

Don't forget that the 16 shards which currently exist are not the only way that Adonalsium could'be shattered. WoB seems to be implying that there could've been other intents which had resulted, and that other attributes could've been imbued into the shards instead of those currently in existence.

 

Oooooo I hadn't seen that. Interesting...

Relevant WoB:

INTERVIEW: Mar 22nd, 2014

WoR Signing Report - Argent (Verbatim)

QUESTION

If Adonalsium shattered with intent, will he always shatter to the same shards?

BRANDON SANDERSON

It is plausible that he could shattered in a different way.

QUESTION

So it could've been different Shards?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Yes, that's plausible.

 

It doesn't disprove my theory though. There was still... not evil but "not good" attributes to Adonalsium. With a slight Sandersonian twist, I could say that this helps my theory: the Shardholders "picked" from the Box rather than "smashed-and-grabbed" it. If there were other potential Shards, it just means more attributes of Adonalsium, not that he was better or worse as a being. 

 

19 hours ago, 1stBondsmith said:

Remember that Adonalsium had 16 Intents. A God Is Autonomous of all other powers. God Cultivates his creations. God punishes and Hates those who do not obey laws. God Always keeps his word Honorably, etc. God establishes change (Ruin) and progression. He is mighty to save (Preservation). Just like Ruin balances Preservation and many other things, an all-powerful God would have all those intents in a perfect balance and used appropriately. I do not think they were kept from humanity, but were used for them.

I'm not saying he's evil, just not empirically good. Most JudeoChristians believe in an empirically good God and I know I was imprinting that onto Adonalsium. Maybe he wasn't. Literally all we know of him is that he was all powerful and that seventeen (at least; could be more depending on if Frost is a Shardholder and if there were others like Hoid who participated but didn't pick up a Shard) "people" wanted to (and did) destroy him. You could just as easily say that Adonalsium (don't want to use God in order to separate from JudeoChristian norms) Cultivates control. It Hates those who do not worship it. It Honors those who Honor it, etc. It could believe that being "used appropriately" is to not give humans attributes, that it was better for the world to have one autonomous and omnipotent overseer ruling the plebeians, a la the Lord Ruler and skaa. Adonalsium directly controlled the world enough that he was a corporeal form with direct contact with "people" on Yolen.  

 

All I'm saying is that we should look at what has been directly said about Adonalsium and what we are assuming based on our own beliefs of gods and religions. Different universe here. 

 

 

[Stark he/him]

On 11/13/2016 at 6:08 AM, Yata said:

But we know that Hoid was born like everyone else and he was originally Human. Now is something different in the same way that Humans deeply twisted by Investiture are no more properly Humans

 

To be fair, it is true that we know Hoid was born like everyone else. But, knowing how sneaky Brandon can be when doling out his WOBs, there are possible interpretations of this:

 

1) Hoid was born like everyone else, and is Human - taken as read(as said for those who actually got to hear it).

2)Hoid was born like everyone else (in the Cosmere), and is Human - and everyone in the Cosmere, whether Human, Kandra, Spren, Seon or Nightblood, were all born as concepts on a page (or word doc if you want to be less poetic).  Hoid may be the only one who stole his concept of self from his author.  It would not be the first time there were fourth-wall breaking characters in fiction (Roland the Gunslinger [Stephen King], and many others)  IT would be the first time we see this in the Cosmere, and it does seem plausible based on some things Hoid has said in Stormlight.  It also gives some hints as to how he knows all the Cosmere life Hacks.  

 

But, if true, I doubt he will be as obvious about it as Wade Wilson is.

 

I'll just add this to my ever-growing list of questions to ask if Brandon is ever in Montreal, or I am lucky enough to be in the same city as him:  Is Hoid aware that he is a character in a fantasy universe?