Humans of Roshar

[bdoble97]

I just finished reading  Arcanum Unbounded hipster listen to this shard cast. So if if the human on Roshat are not originally from there in a from either Ashyn or Braize. How did thwy gwt over to Roshar.  I know this isn't a guarantee that the humans are from a different planet but sounds like it to me. 

[Gizmosowner he/him]

Don't most/all Humans originate from Yolen? Maybe each shard formed a following due to their new powers and decided to take their followers to new planets that they invested in. Odium obviously didn't d this as he had his hatred fueled by his shard and ati and leras went off on their own to sex up a new race of humans

[Weltall]

According to Arcanum Unbounded, all but two worlds were inhabited by humans prior to the Shattering. And one of those worlds was Scadrial, which was made from the ground up by Preservation and Ruin. It's assumed by the writer of the Second Letter that Adonalsium had some sort of Divine Plan and the Shards and Hoid are mucking everything up by stumbling around blindly and meddling with things.

So, in almost every case it's likely that the Shards found life already existing on the worlds they chose to Invest in. In Roshar's case I'm pretty certain that there's WoB out there that the Listeners were on Roshar before humans, which makes it sound like Honor and Cultivation either created humans in place (Tanavast calling himself the creator of humankind suggests that at least some Rosharans may have been created in this manner) or brought them from somewhere else. Or more likely, both. We know the Iriali arrived on Roshar from somewhere, at an unknown time.

41 minutes ago, Gizmosowner said:

Don't most/all Humans originate from Yolen? Maybe each shard formed a following due to their new powers and decided to take their followers to new planets that they invested in.

Yes and no. Yolen is the original homeworld of humanity but we know that humans were on (almost) every planet before the Shattering so most of the Shards would have found humanity already in place.

[Spoolofwhool]

@Weltall Honor didn't call himself the Creator of Mankind. He just used it in reference when identifying himself as the Almighty, as that is a title for the Almighty by Vorinism.

At least that's my interpretation. It's up in the air what he meant, but it fits more with what I've heard.

Edited February 15, 2017 by Spoolofwhool

[Weltall]

@Spoolofwhool I just looked for the quote. You're right and my memory was faulty, he indeed links 'creator of mankind' to being identified by Rosharans as the Almighty rather than claiming that role personally.

[Yezrien]

The whole "Tranquiline Halls" myth is probably a hint that humans migrated to Roshar from somewhere else. Honor and Cultivation probably didn't create humanity on Roshar, but they might have brought it there.

[+Extesian he/him]

4 hours ago, Weltall said:

According to Arcanum Unbounded, all but two worlds were inhabited by humans prior to the Shattering. And one of those worlds was Scadrial, which was made from the ground up by Preservation and Ruin. It's assumed by the writer of the Second Letter that Adonalsium had some sort of Divine Plan and the Shards and Hoid are mucking everything up by stumbling around blindly and meddling with things.

So, in almost every case it's likely that the Shards found life already existing on the worlds they chose to Invest in. In Roshar's case I'm pretty certain that there's WoB out there that the Listeners were on Roshar before humans, which makes it sound like Honor and Cultivation either created humans in place (Tanavast calling himself the creator of humankind suggests that at least some Rosharans may have been created in this manner) or brought them from somewhere else. Or more likely, both. We know the Iriali arrived on Roshar from somewhere, at an unknown time.

Yes and no. Yolen is the original homeworld of humanity but we know that humans were on (almost) every planet before the Shattering so most of the Shards would have found humanity already in place.

Just a clarification. Arcanum Unbounded says there was only two planets that had no humans prior to Shards arriving, not prior to the Shattering. It's possible humans came to other planets post-Shattering but prior to Shards getting there. I don't believe we know how much of a gap there was. There could have been an exodus of humans after the Shattering but before Shards arrived.

[bdoble97]

So what if all humans are refugees from Yolen. In that the original vessels were trying to save the people of Yolen. But were not able to save the planet and were only able to help do a mass Exodus sending  the people to different planets throughout the cosmere then populating those planets.  

[Landis963 he/him]

A good thought, but no.  AU states that humans were around on multiple planets before the Shattering.  

[Weltall]

We also know Yolen is still inhabited. Word of Brandon tells us that Frost (a character we only know about from WoB and, apparently, he shows up in Dragonsteel Prime) isn't a worldhopper so he's still on Yolen and Arcanum Unbounded's essay on Scadrial uses the present tense when it notes that life on that planet is similar to what 'you'll find on Yolen'. Not what 'used to be on Yolen' so there's still life there. Granted it's not confirmed that humans still live there but we know the planet isn't dead. The essay also confirms that at least one concept from the Liar of Partinel draft regarding Yolen's ecosystem is being canonized but that's neither here nor there.

17 hours ago, Extesian said:

Just a clarification. Arcanum Unbounded says there was only two planets that had no humans prior to Shards arriving, not prior to the Shattering.

This is what I get for being so foolish as to paraphrase on a forum where everyone goes through things with a fine-toothed comb and this kind of distinction may be significant. xD

[+Extesian he/him]

1 hour ago, Weltall said:

 

This is what I get for being so foolish as to paraphrase on a forum where everyone goes through things with a fine-toothed comb and this kind of distinction may be significant. xD

Ha Oh I post all the time with inaccuracies I get called on but I'm glad for it because sometimes it can make a difference, and also because there are times thatdiscussions on here about Cosmere theories latch onto a bit of information, make it into truth and for ages noone realizes it was a misunderstanding. I'm sure that humans on other planets pre-dated the Shattering But just in case, and until I see a WoB otherwise, I need to have in my mind that all we know iit's that it's pre-Shard just in case there's an important timeline difference.

[AeonaRin she/her]

On 16.02.2017 at 1:12 AM, Belzedar said:

The whole "Tranquiline Halls" myth is probably a hint that humans migrated to Roshar from somewhere else. Honor and Cultivation probably didn't create humanity on Roshar, but they might have brought it there.

There was a theory I can't find now. But it was about humans coming to Roshar from Ashyn, and I like that idea a lot, because:
- Ashyn is invested but it "currently has no Shard".
- Ashyn is "mostly barren, with a few fertile patches" which might mean there could have been a catastrophic event on that planet.
- Magic on Ashyn is getting powers by getting sick and it's kind of similar to boon/curse system in Old Magic of Nightwatcher (that is connected to a Shard, presumably Cultivation). 

I am going to ask about it at a signing in march. 

 

[Chinsukolo]

On 2/19/2017 at 5:28 PM, strumienpola said:

There was a theory I can't find now. But it was about humans coming to Roshar from Ashyn, and I like that idea a lot, because:
- Ashyn is invested but it "currently has no Shard".
- Ashyn is "mostly barren, with a few fertile patches" which might mean there could have been a catastrophic event on that planet.
- Magic on Ashyn is getting powers by getting sick and it's kind of similar to boon/curse system in Old Magic of Nightwatcher (that is connected to a Shard, presumably Cultivation). 

I am going to ask about it at a signing in march. 

 

This is my opinion/thought as well.  I think that Ashyn is what "mankind" on Roshar remembers as the Tranquil Halls.  What ever magic or event damaged Ashyn as you describe and altered the magic system, is the same event that caused the exodus to Roshar by "most" of the human's there, and its what they consider their "expulsion".  Where those who could not make the exodus are those now living in floating cities getting their magics from diseases.

 

[Cephandrias]

It is common knoledge that humans were not the origanal occupents on Roshar. But where did these humans come from? On Roshar there are glyphs such as; Shash, Shin, Khof, ect... But when I was re-reading warbreaker I noticed that when Siri started teaching the Godking to read she started with the letter Shash. It is my theory that humans on Roshar are origanally from Nalthis (Warbreaker siries.) Also it says in stormlight that when the humans came they brought their god with them. The entire magic system in Warbreaker is based on spoken commands or oaths... possible a connection with Honor. Lastly characters such as Vasher(Zhail), or highmarshal Ashur(Vivienne), or evan Nightblood, have been seen in stormlight. All known crossovers into stormlight have been from Warbreaker so it make sence for human life to be from Nalthis.

[Quantus he/him]

For what it's worth, Syl basically confirmed in the text that the Singers were on Roshar before the Humans arrived, way back at the beginning of OB: She said they have two genders now, as a result of how people view them, but mentioned in an offhand way that the oldest spren had four (like the singers) "Because humans didnt imagine those ones, silly".  I thought is was a slick bit of foreshadowing when I spotted that on a reread. 

 

38 minutes ago, Cephandrias said:

It is common knoledge that humans were not the origanal occupents on Roshar. But where did these humans come from? On Roshar there are glyphs such as; Shash, Shin, Khof, ect... But when I was re-reading warbreaker I noticed that when Siri started teaching the Godking to read she started with the letter Shash. It is my theory that humans on Roshar are origanally from Nalthis (Warbreaker siries.) Also it says in stormlight that when the humans came they brought their god with them. The entire magic system in Warbreaker is based on spoken commands or oaths... possible a connection with Honor. Lastly characters such as Vasher(Zhail), or highmarshal Ashur(Vivienne), or evan Nightblood, have been seen in stormlight. All known crossovers into stormlight have been from Warbreaker so it make sence for human life to be from Nalthis.

The Shash bit between Roshar and Nalthis at least has been asked and he confirmed it was coincidence.  That being said we do know that there's been some significant worldhopping and communication between the two, at least with Nightblood and the Five Scholars, and a prophetic painting or two. And in Doylistic terms, Warbreaker was originially concieved as a backstory book for characters that where in the early Stormlight drafts, so there's likely to be more crossover than with most.  

[Karger he/him]

I personally think that humans came from Ashyn as we know that Ashyn was mostly destroyed and only the flying cities are safe.  Also Shalash could mean "from Ash" or Ashyn they do sound suspiciously similar. 

[Quantus he/him]

8 minutes ago, Karger said:

I personally think that humans came from Ashyn as we know that Ashyn was mostly destroyed and only the flying cities are safe.  Also Shalash could mean "from Ash" or Ashyn they do sound suspiciously similar. 

Oh, that's confirmed in OB.  They migrated from Ashyn when they destroyed too much of it, and settled in Shin (as in A-shin) which was prepared for them and supported their native ecosystem; it's why things like horses, pigs, and chickens all come from Shin.  For what it's worth, we also learned recently that the Heralds were alive during this exodus, though they were not yet Heralds at that point. 

[Kramerfarve]

Btw that was an excellent necro @Cephandrias, next time look at the date on the last post my guy