aPewter Vs. Stormlight

[Baine he/him]

Which one is better? Allomantic pewter seems to have more physical strength and durability, but raw Stormlight has better healing power.

 

Myself, I think I'd choose Stormlight over Pewter, but I'd like to hear your thoughts about it.

[Green Hoodie Mistborn he/him]

I'd have to go with Stormlight, it's far more versitle than Allomantic pewter... you get strength/balance/durability/healing and Surges depending on your order/spren ties. 

[Swimmingly he/him]

Pewter doesn't make you glow, but you have much finer control over it. Stormlight, however, seems to actually heal you instantly rather than just keep you alive while speeding healing slightly.

[Baine he/him]

The only problem I can think of is that Pewter is easier to get on Earth than Stormlight.

 

Can you synthesize Stormlight? Using SCIENCE, of course.

[Cromptj he/him]

I think that stormlight has a much higher Investiture level so it may well make you stronger than Allomantic pewter as well. Remember that Kaladin felt like he was pulling the bridge along singlehanded. The problem with comparing them is that the strength aspect of Stormlight is not really highlighted.

[king of nowhere]

from what I see from the books, stormlight givves better reflexes than pewter. szeth was able to stay in a room full of soldiers and evade all attacks. that's something someone with pewter, no matter how badass, would manage to do. So, i assume stormlight gives better speed. It also gives faster healing. I don't know about strenght, and if it gives balance at all.

[Green Hoodie Mistborn he/him]

On of Teft's thought quotes about Stormlight "perfecting the person" makes me think that it acts similar to the Super Soldier formula that created Capt. America

 

It makes you a/the better/best physical version of yourself, but then also has magical healing going on!

[Baine he/him]

Now here's the REAL question:

 

Captain America Vs. Stormlight Infused Guy (SIG)!

 

Cap would definately win.

[Glaring at the Survivor he/him]

Pfft!

Kaladin Stormblessed would win! And he's the untrained guy!

[Baine he/him]

It wasn't Kaladin Vs. Cap. It was Cap vs. a random Stormlight infused guy.

[Green Hoodie Mistborn he/him]

I think SIG wins because of the healing factor

[Baine he/him]

The healing factor doesn't matter if you can kill the SIG outright. Besides, evetually the Stormlight's gonna run out.

[Pechvarry]

Ugh.  Crossovers. 

 

I would actually like to try to chart the difference between Pewter and Stormlight.

 

Pewter gives:

-Grace (Kinesthesia)

-Speed

-Strength (bucketloads)

-Durability

-Energy

-Slight healing

 

Stormlight gives..?  I'm less sure about this:

-less speed

-less strength

-I don't know how it affects your grace and precision, or if it even does (Kaladin's could be entirely himself, or it could be his Surges, which I'm omitting from this comparison)

-Durability?  I want to say less than Allomantic pewter... but then there's Kaladin's 40 foot drop from bridge into the chasm.  It didn't crack his shins and then heal, Miles-style.  It felt like a 6' drop.

-Energy.  Probably more than Allomantic pewter.

-Healing.  Definitely a lot more than Allomantic pewter.  Obviously not as much as Feruchemical gold though.

 

I think we'd need some good comparison points to make an informed decision. 

[Zenith]

Stormlight gives durability for sure; Szeth was able to survive Gavilar's punch to his face, and that probably would have killed anyone outside of shardplate/stormlight users. The real question is how well a shardplate punch compares to a Allomantic pewter punch; if shardplate happens to be more powerful, then I would tenatively guess that stormlight gives more durability. Right now, I'm going to have to say that Allomantic pewter gives more raw strength and durability (according to the power of the misting/mistborn, of course) than stormlight, as well as being easier to use outside of Scadrial, but stormlight has the added benefits of surges (hmm, that makes me wonder, are soulcasting radiants able to hold stormlight in like Windrunner radiants?), and makes the user much more graceful and heals much, much better.

[Moogle]

Szeth was able to keep everyone in a room full of people who wanted to kill him from hitting him while unarmed. This is something that a Mistborn would have issues with, I think.

 

I suspect, given that Stormlight is literally pure Investiture, that holding Stormlight is way better than burning Allomantic pewter in basically every way. (A Lerasium Mistborn may be slightly better than a Stormlight user, though.)

 

WoR spoilers:

Darkness was capable of running faster than any regular man without apparently requiring much effort on his part. Kaladin could climb stairs that left other bridgemen winded without becoming tired himself, and this was while only holding a small amount of Stormlight.

 

The only thing I wonder at is endurance. Pewter dragging is something that I don't know if Kaladin can do. Assuming he had infinite Stormlight, would he be able to run for hours and hours? I don't know, though I lean towards yes.

Edited March 1, 2014 by Moogle

[Swimmingly he/him]

In my mind the things that make Allomancy trump Stormlight are this: duralumin and Compounding.

[Edgedancer he/him]

WoR spoilers:

Darkness was capable of running faster than any regular man without apparently requiring much effort on his part. Kaladin could climb stairs that left other bridgemen winded without becoming tired himself, and this was while only holding a small amount of Stormlight.

 

The only thing I wonder at is endurance. Pewter dragging is something that I don't know if Kaladin can do. Assuming he had infinite Stormlight, would he be able to run for hours and hours? I don't know, though I lean towards yes.

With Stormlight it seems there is no upper limit, apart from the users storing capability to what they can do while Allomantic pewter has a certain rate it burns with. From what we have know having enough Stormlight to pewter drag would be the harder challenge than doing it. So, I guess that the question comes down to wheter you want a very high amount of power that also runs out quickly or a not small amount that will last you a while. Although Allomantic pewter is a rather fast burning metal itself.

 

Another point is that "the storm inside" that Stormlight causes, seems to animate its user thus it may not be so suited for casual use as pewter is, which just further divides the two into high power and more general power-up.

Edited March 1, 2014 by Edgedancer

[PorridgeBrick he/him]

In my mind the things that make Allomancy trump Stormlight are this: duralumin and Compounding.

Isn't Duralumin just a method to overcome an artificial limitation to Allomancy though? All it does is make metals burn faster. Stormlight, by contrast doesn't seem to have any limit to how fast you can use it up, and there's no mechanic that forces you to use it all up at once either. All Duralumin is is a worse way of doing something Stormlight can do anyway.

[Swimmingly he/him]

But I don't think you can purposefully use all the strength portion of Stormlight at once. Duralumin + pewter can let you perform feats of strength beyond even Shardplate's capacity.

[PorridgeBrick he/him]

True, though I think the other powers Surgebinders have far outweigh that benefit. Besides, after a Duralumin burn, you're helpless. You have to chug a vial of metals before you can do anything. If Kaladin uses up the stormlight inside him, he just takes a breath and now he's Invested again (though I will admit that we don't know if this applies to other orders).

[Pechvarry]

Szeth was able to keep everyone in a room full of people who wanted to kill him from hitting him while unarmed. This is something that a Mistborn would have issues with, I think.

Mistborn had nothing like Szeth. Vin was a genius of intuition, and it showed in her slaughter, but no one on Scadrial was a student of "how to best kill an army" like Szeth. No training in a martial art, like he has. During TLR's rule, there simply were no warrior's cultures.

Aside: thank you very much for remembering to spoiler tag your WoR spoilers. It's getting pretty frustrating how often that's been forgotten in the past couple months.

---

To people mentioning "Stormlight also means Surges", remember that "Pewter also means the whole suite of allomancy" for several main characters. Indeed, Mistborn are more common during classic Scadrial than Surgebinders during the events of Way of Kings (this will almost certainly change). Hence, I'd prefer to leave Surges out of the comparison.

I personally do not think the grace of Stormlight compares to that of Pewter. And I definitely do not think it comes close in physical strength.

EDIT: also, that .7g of Roshar throws stuff off too.

Edited March 1, 2014 by Pechvarry

[Tarion]

My issue here is that we just don't see enough Thugs.  The vast majority of Pewter use in Mistborn comes from Mistborns, who are supplementing it with Tin, as well as using Iron and Steel.  And the only instance I can think of a PoV character using primarily Pewter is the ambush by the Venture bastards at the election.  And then it's against other Pewter users mostly, so it's counteracted.

 

That said, I think the best way is to look at Shardplate.  Would a Pewter burner survive a Shard-powered punch?  I'm tempted to say not.  Pewter just doesn't give that much durability - Remember that Thugs are in danger from people carrying sticks.  That's kind of the point of Hazekillers.  Kelsier takes quite a beating from a group of Hazekillers is book 1, and is left with multiple injuries from their canes that leave him in pain for the rest of the fight.

 

If the impact of sticks carried by normal people is enough to injure pewter burners, and risk breaking their bones, I can't imagine them enduring a hit from a Shardbearer.  They're vastly stronger than a man without Plate - Their kicks are capable of launching heavier-than-human bodies 30 feet.  

Whereas Szeth takes a direct blow to the face, and suffers pain but not injury.  

 

In fact, I quite like this fight for trying to judge the enhancements offered by Pewter.  A squad of 8 people carrying wooden weapons are a serious threat to the armed and prepared Kelsier.  A Mistborn so skilled that he's capable of taking on an Inquisitor.  He's only able to win the fight because he's able to use Iron and Steel.  In a purely physical fight, he'd have been killed.  

 

I can't imagine either Kaladin or Szeth being in that position.  Even the Kaladin who's spent years without wielding a spear, as he is at the end of Way of Kings.  Stormlight allowed Kaladin to take on "dozens" of Parshendi - A group of creatures skilled in combat and far stronger than men.

[Green Hoodie Mistborn he/him]

But I don't think you can purposefully use all the strength portion of Stormlight at once. Duralumin + pewter can let you perform feats of strength beyond even Shardplate's capacity.

 

I'm not sure that we reliably know this on a measurable scale. Is there an instance of Duralumin + pewter burn that we've seen? 

 

As Tarion stated in his post, with Szeth vs. Gavilar and Kelsier vs Haze killers, Stormlight seems very potent. 

 

As for Shardplate... we've only really seen what it's capable of in the hands of non-surgebinders. Normal people using it and powering it with stormlight from gems. In the hands of a KR whose capability/efficiency/power output with Stormlight (so far) as increased with each Ideal stated and adhered to, Shardplate could become even more fearsome. 

 

We also have this WoB talking about the levels of investiture on each world. This seems to me to indicate that the raw power of magics is higher on Roshar vs. Scadrial. 

[TheArcanist he/him]

Well if that's true [And it sure seems to be] then what would happen if a Thug managed to jury-rig the system so that Allomancy could work on Roshar? Would he be limited to just burning pewter, or could he access Stormlight? If the thug could access Stormlight with the same power-level of a Surgebinder, then chances are the only advantage the Surgebinder would have is the Surges themselves.

[Elementalist he/him]

I tend to think that most of Szeth's and Kaladin's greater skill in battle comes from skill rather than stormlight. As someone said, “stormlight doesn't create skill. It perfects what is already there." I think all surges barred, a stormlight user would lose against a Thug with an equal level of skill/training. Maybe I'm biased, though, as Mistborn was my first Cosmere series.