Stark

So, here is some random speculation. The everstorm is here, and has made a few loops of the planet. Our heroes have gathered at Urithiru. All the heralds are (probably, if the man referred to as Taln is actually Taln) wandering around in varying degrees of sanity. We know at least two of these heralds are slotted to be back five flashback characters. So what are the chances that at least a handful of the (mostly) sane Heralds show up in Urithiru this book? I mean there are some depictions of Shalash in Urithiru that aren't defaced, Nale and a maybe-Kalak have been active? With the way things are moving, and with Dalinar giving out visions the way Oprah gives out cars, and the Oathgates reactivating... It seems more than plausible that a few of the Heralds might decide to show up, and oh, I don't know, do their Storming jobs?

Anybody know who won those ARCs from twitter?

I have to say, while this comment is not definitive, it has me feeling that the Unmade are a result of the Heralds breaking is on the right track. Bear with me for a minute. We know there are nine unmade, and that they are of Odium. We are operating under the assumption that they are splinters of Odium, unless there is a WOB out there that explicitly states that they are splinters of Odium himself. We also can assume that the Heralds are not strictly human, though they may have started that way. They are essentially immortal, and come back from death eventually - and bear magnificent artifacts crafted to grant power. Kinda like friendly Nazgul. So if we assume that there have only been nine desolations (unconfirmed), and each one resulted from a different Herald breaking under torture (also unconfirmed), what if the unmade are made by odium, so of odium, but are in fact splinters of the Heralds? What if they are the things that were broken off of the Heralds as they caved under torture? That would account for the sense of loss, and feeling of having been once human. That would allow for the number to have been fixed at nine, and allow us to match one Unmade to each Herald. It also fits with the Herald's being broken, and each having madness. Re-Shepnir being Shallash's missing piece. The Death Rattle Unmade would fit with the Truthwatcher, etc? What if each of these giant, dark spren came into being as Odium Unmade each of the Heralds in turn? More, ancient depictions of Re-Shepnir were of a beautiful woman, dark clad and sultry. Compare this to the end paper painting of Shallash. Which is complementary to this description, yet opposed. It proves nothing. I could still well be wrong. But this info about Re-Shepnir does not disprove me, and it would seem to support that thought.

I think it is similar to how Wyndle said "Ow" when he blocked Nale's Honorblade in Rod form. And she was able to swat the gloryspren. There seems to be some contact available between spren, especially when in physical form. So there was likely a cognitive aspect of the attack that she felt.

Also worth noting, emphasis mine: While with the Listeners, Kaladin has reverted to his childhood nickname of Kal. I wonder, is this their choice, or his? If he told/allowed them to call him Kal, is this a sign that he subconciously realizes that the idealism he is showing for an instantaneous peaceful resolution is a bit childish, and so he uses the childish name he discarded in his youth when he decided to act more like an adult? Or is it because of the relative youth of this society that he reverted to a younger version of his name?

Watch your titles, include the [OB] mark, or @Chaos will be unhappy. And yes, I think that is the point. As a cognitive entity, he has been viewed as such for so long, he is inextricably tied to that role. If enough people thought him different, and truly believed it, for long enough, he would change to fit the new ideal. You see this in a lot of stories involving Gods and prayer, where the deity loses free will through prayer, and is forced to align with the belief of the followers. As a deific Spren, the Stormfather has not much choice in how to act due to the volume of belief about him accrued over millennia. I think change could start now, but it would require many years, and a new religion that achieves global prevalence to be complete. Say a shift from the rider in the storms, who brings them, to the benevolent patriarch, who protects those caught in the storm.

My mental image for Syl swatting the Gloryspren is mildly complex, and amusing, to me at least. She took human form, and swatted at an annoying, glow-y blob of light that was bobbing around Kaladin's head. My imagination sees the spoiler below, but with different text.

JASNAH IS BACK!!!!! I f@#$ing love Jasnah. I've been waiting for her return, damnation you have no idea. And that doesn't manage to overshadow Kaladin yelling at the storm, the storm listening, and him using windspren to part the storm and direct the winds. I lost it, squeeing to myself when the windspren wrapped around his arm, thinking we were getting shardplate, and that it had been said we would not get plate this book. But this was almost as good, and maybe a little better. He shaped the storm. The end to his journey with the Listeners was abrupt and really saddened me. I was hoping for more. But it was poignant. Be better than we were. I was never your captivve, and I am not your enemy. Be better. Then the fused. It sounds like there are a few more forms than at the Everstorm. The Stormforms could not fly. So that is scary. The yellow spren is named Yixli. And she vetted Kaladin. THAT is interesting. Also, I laughed at Syl's slightly jealous slapping of the Gloryspren. I love that he came back. That he tried to help the people. And that he tried to be diplomatic with the guards. "Do you want to fight me? No? Good. I don't want to fight you. I just want these people, and yours to be safe., Shallan's chapter was short, and a bit of a let down, except Jasnah arrived. So part two opens with a reunion, possibly with all our heroes, Dalinar, Kaladin, Shallan, Jasnah, Renarin, Adolin and Navani in a vision quest, seeing what they face?

I'm glad you did. I had been kinda wanting to do that myself, but was not sure how much humor @Mestiv would have had at my usurping his power. So I'm glad you took that leap, and even happier it was found to be amusing.

True. That was a given once we knew that both Shallan and Ash were perspective characters. Which begs the debate as to whether Ash will appear as a Lightweaver, or attract a spren and join a different order, as we already have a Lightweaver book. We also have yet to have confirmation that Eshonai will even be able to be a knight, so it is possible that her book will not have the main perspective character be part of any of the orders, but still have a focus order. But until then, and until I have read Oathbringer, I'm sticking with my weighted options for now. Though the appearance of a Dustbringer at Uritiru has upped the chances that Eshonai's book will be the Dustbringer book significantly, if Eshonai does noot achieve Radiance. But I feel that Ash, if for nothing other than name alone, and some personality things, fits Dustbringer better than Eshonai.

I think we can narrow it down to fewer than 7 options, reasonably. We know that Szeth is one of the next two perspective characters, and he is 95% likely to be the Skybreaker book. We know that Lift, Renarin and Jasnah are in the back five, giving a 95% chance that Edgedancer, Elsecaller and Truthwatcher are out. If we assume that the man known as Taln is indeed Taln, then I would say his book is 60% likely to be the Stonewards. That leaves Willshapers and Dustbringers for Eshonai and Ash.. So I would say that the next book, if it is Szeth, is 100% Skybreaker. If not Szeth, I'd say 50%Willshaper (based on prevalent Eshonai theories, and epigraphs toward Willshaper personalities), 35% Dustbringer, 15% Stoneward. So if the character is not fixed, that puts at a 50% chance of the next book being Skybreaker, 25% Willshaper, 17.5% Dustbringer and 7.5% Stoneward. So four weighted options, not 7, to my mind. And the book's not even out yet.... Who says we have to wait for one book to be out before making wild predictions about the next?

This is exactly why I like debating theories here. We are up front about what info we have, what we are missing, and what holes exist in our theories and proofs. I am excited either way. Edit: We argue the same way Shin haggle, by telling the buyer/reader everything that is wrong or incomplete with our theories, and exposing the areas lacking in value.

My only thoughts on this is that yes, they are fixed. But when did they become fixed? When Rayse took up the shard, he did not instantly have the unmade splintered from him. So at some point, he had to break off the splinters, and we do not know if he broke them all off in one shot, or if he split them off one at a time. All that we know is that they are currently fixed at 9, or at least were when Brandon gave that quote. But you are right, that does strike a pretty decent blow against the theory, but does not necessarily render it invalid outright. Thanks for that info, it will help me construct better questions for if ever I get a chance to ask them.

Megan, a.k.a. Firefight, helped transport her across realities...

To add a bit more to the response, in addition to Hoid being a millenial, Jasnah 8 years older than Elhokar, according to the Coppermind, born in 1139. This puts her at 34 Rosharan years old, compared to Elhokar's 26. I beleive Adolin is 23 (thanks Coppermind, born in 1150) and Renarin is 19. So yeah, when Hoid is told to go pick on someone his own age, it is most likely referring to Slammer as the only one around who is in the same league. Though there may be an Aimian or two that could also qualify.

For me, the hard part will be going back and reading part 1 in physical format, to see everything coherently, and in order. And finding the time to do it. I tend to read pretty fast, but when I'm this excited about a book, I tend to read too fast and miss details. SO my first read will be rushed, and my second read immediately after will be more leisurely...

I remember that discussion. I was wondering if you could spike Sel!

Thats exactly what I think. When counting in base 10, 9 always directly precedes 10, and therefore can be correlated. I think he is doing my favorite thing and giving an answer to a version of the question that was asked, but not THE answer the questioner was seeking. Wow, this is what I do to people? That's extremely frustrating, no wonder people don't like to talk to me... Excuse me, I have to go issue some apologies. But before, that seems to me to have been an artful dodge to the intended question, that could be perceived as being a relevant answer, and may yet turn out to be relevant. But for now, it is a non-answer. It does not confirm or deny anything for me. Which is frustrating, because I am on the "There were nine Desolations before this and each spawned an Unmade as each Herald broke in turn, and now a 10th Unmade will form because Taln, if it really is Taln, finally broke." train...

I think it is going to come back to the hypocrisy discussion with Amaram. If Adolin is revealed, how can Dalinar insist on trying Amaram for murder and theft of his soldiers if he does not bring Adolin to trial for the murder of a Highprince? As for Renarin knowing, we saw him seeing the future in WoR - he knew the Everstorm was coming, but he may not have known how. I think that Renarin sees major points of contention coming up. He sees the everstorm arrive, but not how, not if it can be stopped, and not what the fallout will be. So for Sadeas, I think he sees that Adolin is involved, somehow. But not how. He sees the conflict coming, and hee sees the trial maybe, but not how Adolin got there, and not that Adolin specifically killed him. That, and assuming that Glys, like Pattern, can hear lies, or obscured truths/omissions, I think Renarin has a very good suspicion, but no prrof.

Well, now that you've pointed out the vents, it could totally get stolen by an Aimian. I don't think they would, they seem to be anti-Odium. But with the mink idea, I have this pseudo flashback to Baldur's gate and hear Minsk crying in my head "Go for the Blade Boo, go for the Blade! Then go for the eyes, but first the blade!"

As soon as it was shown to be hidden and not bonded to anyone, I figured it was going to get stolen. Most likely by the same person who killed Asmodean.

For me, there is something about how Jezrien's cape flows that feels off, or not real. I don't know if the wind is supposed to be swirling around him in a mini tornado, or what, but that does not feel realistic. His face also seems a bit off to me. Vedel is harder for me to put my finger on what bugs me. Maybe its the pose, maybe its the active backdrop maybe it is the accessories that bother me. Or maybe its that the second two feel more like a stained glass painting you would find in a church, and are therefore stiff and unlifelike rather than real. The first two feel real. Like we are looking at photos of real people, in real situations. You can tell a bit about the personalities of Shallash and Ishar. The second two feel like paintings in comparison.

So I just started my reread. First thing I noticed, in the prologue was Nale and Kalak(presumed) talking to Elhokar when Szeth walks through the dining area. What was he talking to Elhokar about? So far, we have had Jasnah and Szeth prologues. I wonder who the last two will be? Kaladin and Shallan are out, they were not there. Dalinar is likely out, he was drunk. So... Gavilar? Sadeas? Nale? Renarin or Adolin?

Seems more like its time to get Shai to worldhop - please stamp these books so that they were stored in a cool dry environment, and properly cared for!

Ooh, I like this. Stormlight kinda acting like metal, and blinding/obscuring Shallan from imitation. That is a cool idea. But it seems incomplete. There were points, especially around the weeping when light was being rationed, where Shallan would have been full time in her default form, so Re-Shepir would have been able to image her then. It also does not explain why none of the midnight essence attacked her. Even if it could not detect her true form, it could detect her enough to run from her - so it knew she was there, was aware of her, and would have had plenty of opportunity to copy her in the weeks leading up to this. So it feels incomplete. Yes! It was imitating everyone it had spied on, I think even some of Bridge Four was in the mix! But no Shallan. So either it was so afraid of the Lightweaver that it did not copy her, to avoid drawing her attention (which makes no sense, because no one knew it was imitating them, and Shallan was already detecting it subconsciously)or Shallan is so influx, that it cannot copy her. Or, seeing as it tried to possess her, it did not copy her to avoid offending her with its inferior creations to make bonding easier. Very true point. If I can be finicky about the details to save some face at my error, it was carrying a dead rat in its mouth, which is a rodent. So I was not entirely wrong. But I had focused on the mink, which as you point out, is not a rodent. I was in error. I don't know much about minks, but I understand they are kinda cute - like ferrets, or otters. Am I correct in that, or still entirely wrong?