Ixthos

Just now, Nathrangking said:

alas not. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Rushur_Kris

Just replied to @Bnaya's response which likewise corrected me, but thanks  I really should have checked the coppermind first! My new theory, salvaged from the old, is that Rushur Kris is Khriss's contact and relative. Let's not let coincidental name similarities be ignored!

7 minutes ago, Bnaya said:

that was Rushur Kris, the artist and master artifabrian. When had he arrived? Who had invited him.

RoW prologue. Its probably him.

Ahhh, okay, I'd forgotten about him. Thanks 

Okay, new theory - Rushur Kris is a descendent or relative of Khriss, and may be one of her contacts on Roshar, especially considering his speciality in the local and at the time of the prologue primary Rosharan arcane art of fabrial construction.

... Did Gavilar give Rushu's surname (or second name) as Khriss? If that is what Gavilar said rather than my mishearing her name, does that mean Khriss is masquerading on Roshar as Rushu, or that Rushu is her daughter or a descendent? Of course, I could have misheard that, but if not, that lends itself to three possibilities:

• Rushu is Khriss
• Rushu is related to Khriss (perhaps as a relative who relayed to Khriss what has happened with the development of anti-Investiture
• Rushu has no relation to Khriss, but has a similar surname

The section of audio in question, transcribed:

Quote

Gavilar strode to the bookcase, where one of the new heating fabrials had been delivered to him by the scholar, Rushu Khriss, just earlier in the day. He took it from its clock casing, weighing it.

 

timestamp: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7IAXaDWdKU&t=35m5s

On 3/25/2022 at 11:48 PM, DiePie said:

It seemed to me that Sigzil just refers to the Dawnshard as his "Torment", because of how much pain it's brought to him. He constant curses his inability to harm others as a Torment because it's a direct manifestation of his struggle, something he didn't ask for, didn't want, something he sees himself as being tricked into.

Though getting further from what we know, I think that Aux died after he took up the Dawnshard. Sig may have been told that his oaths as a Radiant would negate some of the Dawnshard's effects -- which would help explain why he thought he was tricked -- but it didn't. Now he's on the run from the "Night Brigade", and has been for what seems to be a while (I think a few years, but all we know for certain it could be anywhere from a few, seemingly long, weeks and centuries spent running, with the Dawnshard preventing his Spiritweb from changing significantly), and during that time he was forced to break his oaths to survive, get away from the Brigade, etc.

What may be interesting is if Sigzil has been running for a few years ... from his perspective. But in actuality every time he Skips, he's actually travelling at the speed of light, not instantaneously, and so when he arrives on a new planet, depending on how far away he's travelled, decades or centuries pass. That would certainly add an interesting twist to the story, as it seems Scadrians (Ghostbloods or the society as a whole) have somehow build underground facilities on at least one other world.

I read something in another thread, I need to find it again and upvote it if I haven't already, but someone suggested something along the lines of Sigzil now in a sense being the "spren" to Aux - the Dawnshard in Sigzel - if he still has it rather than just carrying an imprint - is what gives Aux the power to alter his Connections, etc., and so while Aux can still function as a living blade despite being dead, his other powers are in a sense reversed. The use of "squire" to refer to Nomad does put this in some question though.

18 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

I am afraid I need to point that the very first event Sigzil witnessed on that world was a mass execution. That was followed by gladiatorial combat. I have a problem combining that with general nonviolence. There are nonviolent people, but as a general trait?

 

I refer you to exhibit A, the use of the word "killer" in the story:

Quote

“Maybe?” she said.  “He helped rescue Thomos, who I had missed spotting in the grass.  Tell his family we have him.  But before that, this stranger pretended to be a killer to get me to free him, then wasn’t much use in the fighting.”

[...]

“It is agreeable to me,” Zeal finally said.  “You can trust him to us, Adonalsium-Will-Remember-Our-Plight-Eventually.”

“What if he’s dangerous?” the tall man whispered.  “Rebeke said…he might be a killer.”

“Those are frorens on his wrists, Adonalsium-Will-Remember-Our-Plight-Eventually,” Zeal said.  “Presumably, ones that the Cinder King hasn’t yet had chance to reset.  I think we shall be well.”

[...]

“Maybe he’s a killer!” the bearded man said, grabbing his own chair and settling in, leaning forward.  “Our own killer!  Did you see how he glared at me!”

That…was not how Nomad had expected this man to respond to his presence.  The bearded fellow was smiling, eager.

Rebeke shook her head at the bearded man.  “If he was a killer, I think I’d know it, Jeffrey Jeffrey.”

[...]

“Yet, I offer further grim insight: he will never be taken by surprise again in a raid like this one today.  His cinder killers will stand alert, prepared in wisdom against our further antics of malfeasance.  The Cinder King will nary again allow a clever hack of their frozen bands, and his people will nary again let themselves become so distracted by their games that they relax their guard.

Note especially the middle section that is also underlined. Most people on this world can't process committing violence, but those who can seem to be an asset - we were also seeing things in a city under the Cinder King's control. Also consider how the people first reacted when Sigzil tried to resist - they were shocked and called for the ember warriors, and how the people fled in the arena, the warriors not used to people fighting back.

There are several topics I still want to reply to, but this is one of two posts I felt needed to be made, and something that I've been thinking more and more about recently, and I think this is likely strongly linked to The Sunlit Man, and the overall Cosmere story. I'll try to be brief. This mainly focuses on three points:

• The local magic system likely is powered by a remnant of Ambition, possibly interacting with the warped state of the Threnodites who live there;
• The Nigh Brigade may be Threnodites themselves, or led by remnants of Ambition, and;
• Ambition likely was the one Shard that had the greatest designs on the rest of the Cosmere, and the other Shards.

Still trying to be brief, I will elaborate on each point.

The local magic system has three facets shown thus far - it powers the local equipment, it turns those the Cinder King chooses into his own mixed brand of Inquisitors / Koloss / Awakened / Shades, and the Cinder King himself is somehow a self-controlled version of the ember warriors. Focusing on the last two points, I will make this note - I have personally felt that Ambition is the Shard most likely to see people as a resource, something to warp and change as one wants to further ones own ends. This is speculation on my part, but I think both sides of this are shown with the Cinder King and the ember warriors. For the ember warriors, they were people the Cinder King deemed useful and then forcibly changed, turning them into a type of undead that obey him - as seen with Elegy, who likely didn't consent to the procedure and fought against him, but now is a near animal under his control, likely because of the change. This is a combination of Inquisitors and Koloss, making empowered warriors matching Inquisitors, and turning those who once fought against you into monsters for Koloss. They also are in a sense corpses animated by magic now also, similar to Inquisitors (I know that is debatable, but I personally see Inquisitors as a type of undead) and the Awakening (even putting aside the comparison drawn to Awakened corpses rising that Nomad made), albeit rather than taking a dead body and making it serve it is in effect killing a live person and warping them - though perhaps there is a way to reverse it, or grant them self control if they truly are lacking it. They also mirror Shades - note what Aux and Nomad discuss:

Quote

“That I did pick out,” he said, thoughtful.  “Threnodites.  Don’t they…persist when they’re killed?”

They turn into shades, under the right circumstances, the knight explained to his dull-minded squire.  Who really should remember almost being eaten by one.

“Right,” he said.  “Red eyes.  Complete lack of memories.  I feel like we would have seen those, though.  Shades come out in the darkness, and we’ve been in nothing but darkness since getting here.”

Perhaps this group split off before the Shard’s death—and the event’s after-effects—took them.

I think Aux is wrong about that last part. I think the Cinder King's ember warriors are the result of the local remnant of Ambition - remember, Ambition left chunks in the Threnodite system, and then fled and died elsewhere (*cough* Silverlight *cough*), and thus could have left remnants in other systems. I think this is the result of the interaction of two different splinters of Ambition, the splinters left in the Threnodite people, and the local magic - it allows those who otherwise would become Shades to be transformed into something effectively undead, still losing the person who once was that body, but now in an actual body rather than as a Cognitive Shadow. Rather than the dead Threnodites becoming Shades - and perhaps the sun of this world would destroy any Shades that did form, and consider their aversion to killing - they are instead possibly killed and turned into physical cadavers, still lacking their original memories and still undead.

The Cinder King himself is the flipside of this. At first I thought he was implied to be someone who was still in the process of turning into an ember warrior, but it now after seeing someone else forceably transformed, it seems clear he somehow is someone who retained human will, possibly a closer to human anatomy without the full loss of his chest - or at least that loss is hidden - and implicitly some sort of touch-based power that Nomad is immune to. And he is implied to be ambitious, taking over columns, and changing people - he is a sentient, self-aware and self-controlled version of the otherwise hapless victims of the embers, and has desires to expand his control and turn people into his tools - he is ambitious.

Trying to be brief(er), the last two points will be somewhat more summarised - I'm trying to be brief but I might be rambling slightly. We know Brandon wants to make a novel called Dust Brigade, set on Threnody. It is therefore likely the Night Brigade are themselves Threnodites as well, though human or otherwise it isn't clear. They are hunting Sigzil - and possibly would also be interested in hunting Hoid - either with or to gain access to the Dawnshard Sigzil either has or had, as it isn't exactly clear where it is or if the Night Brigade has or wants to have a Dawnshard, or all of them. Either way, they also are seemingly displaying great Ambition, and are implied to be a threat to any world Sigzil, Nomad, remains on. Thus they may be one of the powers of Threnody the Ire were aware of, and as they likely have Ambition based Investiture, splintered though it may be, they may have large scale designs on the entire Cosmere, and the worlds and even the Shards within.

Finally, we know Odium wanted to kill Ambition first, and Endowment thought Ambition would have been a threat - maybe Odium did the Cosmere a solid by killing Ambition - with Mercy, something implicitly at least partially a counter to Ambition (and see my theory on how Odium exploits the dissonance between Shards to take on multiple Shards at once, Odium's power being that of opposition and disagreement just as Honour is of bonds and Cultivation is of growth) - so it seems likely, especially considering Endowment sees the Shards as things that should be separate, that Ambition may have wanted to reunite the Shards to become stronger, the most Ambitious goal a Shard could have, even more so than Odium's. If anything of Uli Da remains, or anything is affected by Ambitions Intent, it likely is a threat to the Cosmere greater even than Odium - Odium may be the most dangerous Shard, the Shard that would plunge the Cosmere into war, stoking hatred and violence, but Ambition, or anything powered by it, would seek to become stronger and stronger, and while Odium would revel in war and may change people, Ambition would see the life in the Cosmere as a resource, and it may be what emerges under its control - or anything that is a remnant of Ambition - may be worse off than a Shade or ember warrior, with even less agency.

One of two posts I'm making quickly, this one being the shorter of the pair. 

This is a world that mirrors Nomad perfectly - Nomad has been rendered unable to inflict physical violence deliberately and must always be on the move, while this is a world where most of the people seem to have a strange aversion to killing or fighting in general, and where they always have to move, to avoid danger that relentlessly travels behind them. The second point is one Brandon already made, that this world matches Nomads need to keep moving, but the first I think is relevant also.

Nomad can't force himself to directly harm people, and he always has to keep moving. On this world that behaviour, both parts of it, are the norm.

Also, because this post is very short, and the second one is getting longer than I liked, I'll also just say this quickly. I like that we are in a sense seeing that may be a type of "what if?" story for the Cosmere - a "what if" someone from another world had visited Scadrial, and brought there own strange magic to oppose the Lord Ruler. "What if" Kelsier's crew was aided by an Awakener, or a Sand Master, or an Elantrian (with access to the Dor). Or even if Hoid had gotten directly involved. Sigzil has arrived on this world, with a great deal of knowledge about the rest of the Cosmere, and just entered into another people's struggle for survival against what is implied to be a would-be world conqueror (possibly with Scadrian support or an awareness of Scadrial). I think it is very interesting to see the story of someone who is fleeing from a terrible Cosmere-level danger, and stuck now helping a local resistance or refugee group that is struggling against a genuine threat to their own world, a dark lord who turns their own beloved people against them, and who himself is likely going to be annihilated if the Night Brigade reach him. It's like if Keliser's crew was fighting against Rashek, who himself is trying to contain Ruin, only for a Knight Radiant to show up who is on the run from something like Odium (though obviously we don't know the true level of danger the Night Brigade represents beyond the implicit threat they represent in Wit's cryptic statement about worlds dying).

45 minutes ago, Trutharchivist said:

I actually meant much more recent, inner developments - the Zionists and their effects on Sephardic Olim at the time the state of Israel was funded, probably going back only as far as the enlightenment's effect on Judaism... But full history of the Jewish people (at least, around the last thousand years or so) may be somewhat called for too. I'm not completely sure. I assume you thought I meant the latter from other things you said on your post, I might be mistaken.

Also, for some reason I just thought about it now, but I know a Christian Sharder that I think would like to answer your question and does not belong to the LDS (far shorter, don't you think?). @Ixthos, are you interested?

Thanks for the notification!

This is a big topic, and responding in full will take some time - I'll try to be thorough but brief for now, and I can go into further detail later if needed.

My religious life affects me in overt and subtle ways, and likely in some ways I'm not even aware of. I was born into a religious household, though I myself hold some heterodox views on some topics, while in others I stick very close to the mainstream view, though I believe both mine and others eyes in the Church should keep our focus on God rather than on any given celebrity of the faith - people are people and will always let you down somehow. God knows my own flaws and failings better than I do.

It's a bit difficult to say precisely how being religious affects me, especially because even among my peers I'm ... odd. Decoupling what is and isn't a part of my world view from what is just because of my ADHD, odd perspective, and other parts of my upbringing, from my religious beliefs is very challenging, especially because of the oddities in my religious beliefs compared to many of my Brothers and Sisters, who are still my Brothers and Sisters even when I (seldom) disagree with them. I tend to take a simultaneously spiritual and materialistic view of the world, especially as I personally believe the two aren't necessarily separate categories - that is an aspect of Greek thinking that I disagree with, and feel is too pervasive in the Church. For a long time I had difficulty reconciling the Seven Days of Creation with modern scientific views, and there still is a little wonkieness there, but mostly or perhaps completely have that reconciled now.

I see God and the supernatural and spiritual in everything, but also nature as nature and governed by physics - again, the two are not necessarily separate all the time, and I think you can see the sunrise and say that it is equally the product of natural physics as it is a sign of God's love for us, just as you can say the laws of physics are the result of God's imposing order on chaos, the chaos itself formed specifically by God to produce randomness.

... and it is at this point where I had to stop myself writing for a sec before I launched fully into explaining my theological views, why God created Humanity, the nature of spiritual beings, the fall of man, and the nature and mission of Yeshua, Jesus. Needless to say, that may get a little much for the moment, but if anyone is interested PM me and I'll be happy to elaborate.

To try to focus in on the core question asked here, having covered a few topics now and feeling more like I understand the question a little better, I would say it mainly has affected me by granting me peace. Peace in knowing God is in control, no matter what happens, how bad things become or how badly I fail or fall or am hurt. I have peace knowing that there is a purpose to existence and to humanity, peace knowing God and science are not opposites but that science comes from the study of the beauty of what God has done and that one can worship God by studying it and seeking to understand the pure mechanics of nature as well as its spiritual side without letting either one get in the way of the other. I have peace in knowing that all things work together for God, for those that love God, and that He is just and merciful, even taking into account how dark and terrible the world is. I have peace in Him. In the past, the present, and the future, my faith and hope in Him, and the certainty of how much everyone on the planet, people in the past and present and future, and creation itself, matters to Him, gives me peace. That is absolutely something that, all other things aside, I can say with absolute certainty is something that comes from my religious beliefs and faith in God, and wouldn't be there without it. God has everything in hand, and has not left this world broken, not walked away from a damaged creation, but has stepped in to help us, to suffer with us, and to save us - that He has done the work, the lifeguard who threw the rope and is pulling us back in, not requiring further effort on our part beyond holding on and trusting in Him.

... and I was getting into theology again. Though with this topic, I suppose it is hard not to. Anyhow, I hope that helps answer the question.

7 minutes ago, RedBlue said:

It makes a lot of sense that Sigzil’s Windrunning and Radiant oaths are the key to getting around his Torment. Makes me wonder if Wit was hoping to circumvent his own Torment problems when he bonded Design.

I’m leaning towards thinking that Aux is Sigzil’s original spren. Firstly, they apparently knew each other quite well when Aux was alive, which isn’t common between spren and humans who aren’t bonded. Secondly, Sigzil is implied to have killed Aux, which would be difficult to do if they weren’t bonded when Aux was alive.

I suppose it’s possible that Sigzil could have bonded a second spren and then killed him, but a Windrunner bonding a second spren seems unlikely given what’s going on in Stormlight. There aren’t enough spren to go around as it is. 

I agree it seems most likely Aux was Sigzil's original spren. Something I'm wondering is, as we know Rysn was forbidden to bond a spren after becoming a Dawnshard, if that has anything to do with Aux's state? Sigzil was told he had to take up a Dawnshard for the good of Roshar or the Cosmere, but that he had to let his spren die to do it, and so both reluctantly killed him, though with the BAM issue sorted the death wasn't as damaging?

I theorise that Sigzil, Nomad, can override his Torment when we seeks to be what he once was - a Windrunner. I don't know if Aux is his original spren or not, but it seems he is dead, and by implication by Sigzil's own actions.

Quote

It’s your Torment, the knight helpfully observed to his moderately-capable squire.  It has grown strong enough to deny you weapons.

Nomad dodged back again, while the ember man slammed his baton down in another near miss—making the ground tremble at the impact.  Storms.  That light was getting brighter.  Covering the entire horizon in a way that felt too even.  How…how large was the sun on this planet?

“I thought,” Nomad shouted, “that my oaths overrode that aspect of the Torment!”

I’m sorry, Nomad.  But what oaths?

[...]

You might be in trouble this time, Auxiliary said.

“You think?

Do I think?  I’m not sure.  Depends on your definition.

“You know, I liked you much better when you were alive.”

And who is to blame for that?

So, he suspects his old oaths let him summon weapons, even though at present he can't. Though it is puzzling that, if Aux is dead, why did Sigzil think his oaths still held? Are these different oaths, is Aux dead for some other reason?

Either way, Nomad can't seem to summon weapons. However ...

Quote

[...]

The crowd cheered as Glowing Eyes raised the second spear.  The poor captive screamed a piteous sound, pulling against his captors, trying desperately to escape.

Not my problem, Nomad thought, closing his eyes.

But he could still hear.  And somehow, in shutting out the light—there within the blackness of his own design—he felt something.  Of the person he’d once been.  And words he’d once spoken.  In a moment of glorious radiance.

Damnation, he thought as the man’s terrified shouts shook him to the core.

[...]

He whipped his hand forward then, throwing Auxiliary to spin—flashing and glorious—through the air.  Aux slammed into one of the pillars on the podium right next to Glowing Eye’s head: a six-foot long, glittering sword.  Auxiliary’s truest form.  It sank into the pillar up to Auxiliary’s hilt, then hung there, quivering.

The crowd hushed.

Huh, Auxiliary said in his head.  I thought you couldn’t do that anymore.

He intentionally hadn’t aimed for Glowing Eyes, as to not be a threat—and not trigger the Torment.  But it had been a while since Nomad had seen the full Blade, been able to access it in its glory.  The crowd hushed, and as Nomad hoped, Glowing Eyes gaped at the sword—forgetting his captive.  The gap-toothed man huddled in the grips of the officers, but hadn’t been touched by the spear, not yet.

Nomad resummoned Auxiliary, and tried to form the Blade again.  He failed.  The Torment seemed to have slipped that once, but now it was adamant.  No weapons.

Even taking into account he hadn't been trying to attack, only destact, it is significant.

and later, when with others who would suffer a terrible fate if captured:

Quote

Ahead of him, the pilot leaned down even lower behind a short windshield, the throttle—least, that was what he guessed the lever was—smashed forward as far as it would go.  The gap-toothed man that Nomad had rescued clung to his seat, eyes wide, hair fluttering the wind.

Nomad glanced ahead of them, hoping to see some kind of defensive force up there.  A fortress, or a line of fighters waiting for them to arrive.

[... he sees the rings, etc., but nothing that can help the others ...]

So Nomad took a deep breath, then stood up, dashed along the length of the hover bike, and jumped.

Wind against his tattered clothing.

An infinite expanse above.

Distant land below, looking up, aspirational.

It felt familiar.  Nomad and the sky weren’t currently on speaking terms.  But they’d been intimate for some time in the past, and he still knew his way around her place.

He felt…stronger now.  Where he’d struggled to make the leap onto that box earlier in the day, this time he soared.

Even the ember people seemed amazed by the distance he got with that leap, soaring over their heads, hitting their platform right behind them with enough force to shake the vessel. 

I will protect those who cannot protect themselves.

Whatever happened to Nomad, the Windrunner remains within him. I suspect that his oaths, dead though they may be, still have a shred of life within them, and that is enough for him to still cause harm - so long as it is in the service of saving others. To use shreds of the power that he once possessed and summon his blade as a weapon - provided he remembers the journey.

I'm still reading - at the point where he just got chained up again after defeating the Ember woman - but I read a rather interesting line that may tie to this (if anyone has read further and this is answered more clearly, please let me know)

Quote

You might be in trouble this time, Auxiliary said.

"You think?"

Do I think? I'm not sure. Depends on your definition.

"You know, I liked you much better when you were alive."

And who is to blame for that?

Perhaps this is the new consequence of a Knight breaking their oath, the Knight now stuck with a restriction on what they can do - they made an oath, broke it, and now are forced to adhere to a new set of restrictions.

Harmony. Or TenSoon. Or, preferably, both.

I know it sounds weird, but I'm hoping we get a story focused on and told entirely from the viewpoint of a Shard. Harmony - working through Kandra agents - on an O'Neill Cylinder would be my guess. It's crazy, probably not the case, but I think it would be an amazing story to have a space age infiltration story on a space station from the viewpoint of a Shard, or TenSoon as a shapeshifting agent, or both.

10 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

Brandon gave some more clarification on the SP4 protagonist, for some last-minute theorizing:

Hoid's officially off the list. Somebody who has had viewpoints, though; that's new, right?

Mennis!

Okay, jokes aside, here is a possible list of those characters: https://coppermind.net/wiki/Category:Viewpoint_characters

Probably not Alcatraz though.

On 3/18/2022 at 3:27 PM, melaan enjoyer said:

my brain went into overdrive reading SP3.

first of all i love design < 3

second of all: hoid??? frozen??? in time????? implications!!!!

 

genuinely cant wait to read the whole book

Indeed! Lots of implications, including the question of whether he chose to be frozen, knew it was coming, or was taken by surprise.

On 3/18/2022 at 4:13 PM, Michael Portz said:

I ld say that is just his way to travel forward in time.

Well, that and turning himself into a convenient piece of furniture, but yes 

On 3/18/2022 at 4:31 PM, PurpurPhönix said:

I could see that, although he does seem to spend a lot of time out doing stuff for someone who still seems to be as young as he is, if his only way of traveling through time is to freeze himself in it.

I suppose it depends on how often and how long he is frozen. This could be something that only happens for half his life - for each lifetime he lives he spends another frozen in place?

On 3/18/2022 at 4:34 PM, Czernobog said:

Possibly, but "when my ailment first struck" speaks to a certain lack of volition in the matter.

Agreed - ailment implies it at the very least is a bother to him. Even more so when it freezes him in a place which subsequently became noodle central. It makes me wonder how much control over when or foreknowledge he had that he was about to be frozen.

On 3/18/2022 at 4:35 PM, AerionBFII said:

I am convinced Brandon was smirking when he wrote the noodle scene. 
 

I’ve wondered how Hoid time skipped, the coat hanger was… unexpected. But in character. 
 

This method obviously predates Soul casting but I have no idea how he manages it. 

Smirking, and eating ramen!

By implication this may in some way be related to speed bubbles, though his mind is then somehow decoupled, at least at first, from the effect due to his internal screaming when painted by Design. Though there is irony in that too:

"Okay, based on my input you got to design how I looked," Design said, reaching for the paint. "Now its my turn!"

On 3/17/2022 at 10:12 PM, eltari said:

Yup. I assume this is how he puts himself into stasis. And Design being a spren, deciding to use him as a coat rack as a joke on him.

I'm wondering if it isn't something he chooses, but rather something that he either has to do after a given period, or something that comes randomly upon him - he's minding his own business when suddenly he gets frozen in time, provided Fortune isn't compelling him to go somewhere.

On 3/17/2022 at 8:01 PM, Oltux72 said:

Am I the only one reminded of Han Solo?

Mercy and Hoid fighting with Shard Blades.
Mercy: Did Frost tell you what really happened to your old teacher?
Hoid: You killed him!
Mercy: No, I am your teacher.
Hoid: Noooo
... and just lets them switch on the time freezing machine. Then Destiny carries him off in a spaceship made from Aethers.

"Your thoughts betray you. Your feelings for them are strong. Especially for ... bacon. So, you have a love of bacon."

"I don't like sand, its course and rough and irritating, and it gets everywhere. Stop that, Kenton."

On 3/20/2022 at 4:10 AM, Kandrafish said:

This would mean that the Iriali would have good reason to join Odium's team, since they both want to travel the cosmere and use Roshar as a home base.

That certainly could be a large part of it and would make sense - joining his team may also help in accessing his Investiture as well, furthering their connection to him.

On 3/20/2022 at 4:10 AM, Kandrafish said:

Maybe the Iriali don't even know fully what they are doing or why like Hoid because of Fortune being used, but they are fulfilling some sort of divine mandate. A prophecy, if you will, and by doing as their religion dictates, they are helping to reform the One!

I like this! A final plan laid out in advance with a purpose beyond what they know, but still slowly coming to fruition.

This is a minor thing, and Brandon mentioned he used Korea and Japan as models for this story, but I really like how the two worlds mirror each other in several ways.

• Painter (Nikaro) is on a world that is evocative of modern Japan, at least in cyberpunk stories, with the hion like neon lines and signs and noodle bars, while Yumi's world of Torio more closely mirrors classical Asian cultures, with a more open, pastorial setting
• The darkness and gloom and sense of chill from Painter's world and its blackness, and Torio's bright sun and heat and redness - Virtuosity's splintering plunged Painter's world into shadow, while whatever its previous state Torio's current state is one of bright light
• Painter is a working man whose job is important but whose profession is lowly, Yumi is an honoured and revered figure held up by all who see her in ritual honour - and both are crushed by their roles
• Painter chose his role and regrets it, Yumi was born to hers and can't escape it
• Painter binds dark horrifying spirits to one form to prevent them from doing harm almost measuring them like spren, Yumi binds warm and bright spirits to one form - a bifurcated form - so they can benefit civilisation
• Nightmares are like yokai and mirror urban supernatural horror stories, spirits are like kami and mirror the respect one pays in Shintoism to the spirits of the world and with their own shrines
• Painter typically does things in the most boring and lest effort expended manner possible, while Yumi poured her soul - literally - into what she does

This setting is functionally a Yin-Yang world - darkness and light, cold and hot, benevolent spirits and malevolent spirits, magic revered and magic mundane. This binary aspect is likely key also to the plot, and each character coming to peace with their role, or adjusting their role to better fit what its true function is and their own needs from it, and taking the best traits from each other.

(Also, completely unrelated, can we appreciate how accurate Hoid's words about Yumi's ... "warden" are?

Quote

It takes real talent to use an honorific as an insult. I’ll give Liyun that much; it’s professional courtesy, from one hideous bastard to another.

That sums her up nicely. Who sees a child crying and scorns them for it?

I also hope Design can see Painter when Yumi visits the shop. I like how she ties in to the idea almost of the trickster spirit in the form of an attractive young woman you sometimes see in Anime.)

See Hoid.

Hoid likes noodles (https://wob.coppermind.net/adv_search/?query=noodles).

Hoid has been waiting a long time for noodles to be invented on other worlds.

Hoid now partly owns a noodle shop.

Hoid's spren Design, the other owner, runs said noodle shop. Hoid even helped pick out her uniform for running said noodle shop. And her face. And her curv-

Hoid spends a lot of time in this noodle shop.

All day in fact.

Hoid is an important part of the shop.

But no noodles for Hoid. Because he's a coat rack.

3 minutes ago, PurpurPhönix said:

Virtuosity is not having virtue but rather being artistically talented, usually musically. It's related to the word virtuoso. 

I thought the same thing at first until I saw someone else bring up the difference.

Ahhh! That makes a lot of sense - so "Skill", not virtue. Then it likely pairs with Invention, and would be another "blue" Shard. Thanks!

... Well, that certainly wasn't expected. I wonder if he is like that because he isn't Virtuous enough. ([Edit] I've been informed that Virtuosity is closer in meaning to skill than virtue. Never mind.)

I guess Hoid is a little like Castle Heterodyn. He may be stuck in time - assuming that is an accurate description - but his mind and powers are still free to Lightweave. Is he drawing power from the hion lines?

Just now, phraps said:

Ah, I think I misunderstood your original post. We're on the same page now.

The only problem with your theory, which is a good one, is that Painter's people have used telescopes to see their neighboring planet and can tell it's inhabited. If they were looking at Taldain, the light from the star would totally wash out the visibility of Taldain (the planet). So I think it's more likely that Painter's "star" is another planet in the same system.

Ahhh, that does make this theory somewhat unlikely - still, maybe its half right and the reflected light from their sister world becomes Invested and so that is how it can be seen. I probably should finish reading the chapters first! 

1 minute ago, phraps said:

Your questions are somewhat answered later in the excerpt.

The "star" in Painter's sky is actually another planet. Also, Taldain is the sole planet of its system. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe all of the secret projects take place on new worlds. 

My confusion is, Painter lives in perpetual darkness but Yumi has a day-night cycle. I'm not sure how that's possible unless Painter lives at one of the poles. I initially thought that Painter lives in the Cognitive Realm while Yumi lives in the Physical Realm, but 

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the scene with Design makes it clear Hoid used Lightweaving to project a "body" onto Design's Physical manifestation, meaning it takes place in the Physical Realm

 

Taldain is a planet, yes, but I am referring to Taldain the system, and in particular I mentioned their star - I'm arguing that Invested light is breaching the shroud from a different star system. Still, thanks for the heads up 

Still reading - I'm having to snatch moments, and I'm still writing random thoughts as new posts here  - but I think, if I am right, there is a "cloud" of sorts surrounding Painter's side of the planet. I think they are on the same planet, but Painter is on a side with a magical cloud covering it, and only invested light can get through. Basically think of it like the planet is half covered and half uncovered. Painter is on the covered side, Yumi on the uncovered side. The covered side can't see the sun because the sun doesn't have Invested light, but the star - what I thought was a star at least, though thanks for the correction - has Invested light.

Though perhaps those theories will be shown false later when I've finished reading it 

([Edit] To clarify for anyone reading this - this theory was something I posted before finishing reading the extracts Brandon had published, including the reveal the star is actually a planet and the implication that it is the planet Yumi is from, rather than them both being on the same planet. So the star certainly isn't the Taldain system, though I do wonder if Taldain's light could pierce the shroud as well, or only light from the sister world, or anything related to Virtuosity.)

Still haven't finished reading it yet, but this thought came to me when the star was first mentioned, and so this may be answered in the sample, but I'm wondering if the star they see is Taldain.

Taldain orbits a supergiant star, which likely is very visible throughout the Cosmere - consider our own Sirius. It's light is Invested, and it may allow it to pierce through the shroud, as that shroud certainly seems to block out regular sunlight if the two stars are the same - this being two different areas of the same planet.

A second point - this certainly would make the Cognitive perception of the inhabitants divided ... just like the inhabitants of Taldain likely are divided on their own divided sky with Darkside and Dayside. And we know Roshar has an expanse called the Expanse of the Broken Sky. Perhaps these two worlds are very close together, Taldain and this planet, and they are both unified in having two completely different perceptions on the nature of their sky.

1 minute ago, Zibus said:

Dude, I literally stopped to come and do the exact same thing. This is huge! This gives us 15/16 Shard names, and I wouldn't be surprised if we get another in one of these secret projects.

 

I've theorized about there being a Shard like this, in my own personal ideas about what I'd do with a world like the Cosmere. But all my ideas were very different from Virtuosity being the Intent of the Shard. I wonder what we might glean about her reasons from this work...

Yup! I still remember being surprised that Whimsy was a Shard, but then it does make sense. I imagine Virtuosity may be partially a compliment to Ambition - adding limits on how far you can go - and to Devotion and Dominion, setting appropriate modes of response.

5 minutes ago, Nameless said:

Might have been this WoB:

But it doesn't say anything about only four shards being splintered. Just that those are the four Brandon had canonized as splintered at the time.

That might be it. I'll have a further look later to see if I can find what I'm thinking of, though I may have been thinking of this one. Thanks 

6 minutes ago, Nameless said:

Yeah, that is interesting. I wonder if silver has an effect on whatever investiture there is on this planet?

Perhaps. I haven't finished the sample yet, though this is certainly an interesting setting.