AquaRegia

Agreed; I have now seen the relevant WoB. I sit corrected, thanks. He does explicitly state that she was killed (by Cord) last time. I really wish that their first meeting had happened on-screen!

I am honored to join the Eternal Thread. I’m sorry I missed the beginning… but I see it as a blessing that I was forced to read 12 pages of heartfelt discussion before responding. I’m confident we can all agree: we crave divergent points of view in our heroes, done convincingly and authentically. Some of us prefer to wait, rather than see it done poorly; others want it NOW, perfect or not. I see the allure of both opinions. I really just want to give everyone here a hug, and thank you for all the thought, effort and passion that has gone into this glorious work of messy art. We are all flawed humans, trying to cope in an imperfect world. We all deserve love, respect, and storms yes, representation in literature. Thanks to AonEne, Comatose, Kidpen, The Awakened Salad, likehephaestion, and to Honorless, especially, for being willing to reach out to others and share their (sometimes painful) realities. Isn’t the point of fiction to help us understand each other’s stories? This topic has definitely done so for me. From this vanilla white male cis/het, thank you all. Finally, while I know the OP specifically asked about gay male protagonists, I do want to call attention to another incremental Sanderson triumph in RoW - our first trans viewpoint character. I love that Leshwi is unquestionably a "she" to literally everyone, even people who have ONLY EVER SEEN HER in a malen body, e.g., Kaladin. I found the writing so natural and convincing that I was finished with the book before I realized: “wait - so Leshwi is trans…?” Well done, sir. EDIT: I have re-read some of the Leshwi scenes, and I was mistaken (thanks to Daggon Forescout). Kaladin HAS seen Leshwi in other bodies (presumably at least some were femalen) before their first ONSCREEN meeting. Also, Leshwi isn't a "viewpoint" character... but we do see her quite a bit through Venli. I apologize for being a little overenthusiastic.

Well, I must say this sounds ABSOLUTELY STORMING FABULOUS. FanFic writers, get busy.

I can't say this is impossible, but I find it extremely unlikely. The only people living in Urithiru are those who were living in the warcamps, right? The Oathgate to Kholinar was never activated (except for the raid to get Jezrien's honorblade, maybe?). My guess is that the most likely reason for a RAFO is that Tarah might show up later, married to someone else, just to give Kaladin yet another thing to be depressed about and then to eventually work through.

I agree very much with this, and I'm one of those (up until recently, anyway) relatively casual readers. Six Mistborn novels, Warbreaker, Elantris, check, but no "extra" content, no WoBs, no podcasts or vlogs, etc. I didn't have ANY notions of what Rayse/Odium "should be" before now except what I've got from the pages of Stormlight novels. I agree it was a very abrupt reversal for Rayse to suddenly be gone... but I think that might be the storytelling point. Sometimes everything changes because of a spilt-second lucky break, and even gods can't see everything that might happen. I have no problem with the idea that Rayse was worn down from all his millennia of war against other shards, and had gotten to the point where his personality was barely hanging on and losing control of the power. Now, we have a relatively fresh, energetic vessel for Odium, which is way scarier. I love how T.Odium has these deep inner conflicts: hate and destroy vs. plot and save, brilliance vs. compassion. My hope is that having been touched by Cultivation will turn out to be an important factor in his arc going forward. And as far as Wit/Hoid goes, I'd really like to see him finally DO something, ANYTHING! For the "most powerful non-shard being in the Cosmere", he sure has been frustratingly absent and/or inert for four novels so far. Same with Zahel. I expect to be shown what these jokers have really been up to all this time.

I don't see any reason why the two can't be related, but not the same thing. The Cosmere is chock-full of things that are "similar but not the same" - it's one of Brandon's favorite answers. Part of the fun is finding out that something we thought we understood is really just a small part of a larger whole. I won't be surprised when we find that highstorms, perpendicularities, elsecalling, and other stuff we haven't even seen yet are all revealed to be manifestations of the same underlying mechanism of investiture moving between realms. I just reread the "Jasnah returns form Shadesmar" scene in WoR - Wit asks her "couldn't you have elsecalled somewhere closer?" This implies 1) she DID use elsecalling (or at least he thinks so), 2) while he knew where she was going to arrive, he thinks she could have done so other places as well. Still not clear exactly what it means, though.

I'm glad to know that my honey and I were not the only ones who failed to deduce this from the text. We'd still be completely ignorant of this apparently-coming-in-the-very-next-novel relationship without the WoBs. I'm also glad we had a robust discussion of "romantic attraction as distinct from sexual attraction", as that's the reply that immediately came to my mind upon reading Necessary Eagle's OP. PLENTY of folks have romantic love without the urge to make babies. In fact, given the realities of population pressure, economics, and aging, I'd guess it's the most common situation. I'll add a few things I've been wondering. In another post here on the shard, someone mentioned "singers have 4 genders"... is that canon? I don't recall any gender descriptors ever being used for parshmen/parshendi/listeners/singers beyond the familiar he/she pronouns and malen/femalen for both noun and adjective. I think it's very well-established that they are identifiable as malen or femalen no matter what form they happen to be wearing, and mateform and mating were described pretty explicitly as a "pairing". Whence comes "4 genders"? I also have a ton of questions in my head about Leshwi and her current malen body. I love that she remains "she" to literally everyone, not only other fused who have known her for centuries, but also her servants, who can see the body is malen, and people who have ONLY EVER SEEN HER in that malen body, e.g., Kaladin. How did THAT play out, exactly? Do fused as disembodied souls exercise control over which singer body they take? If so, do some care more about gender than others? Would, say, Lezian the Pursuer Defeated One (were he to come back again) be equally satisfied with a femalen body to inhabit? And what are the limits to which their soul can re-mold that new body? But I really love how Brandon very naturally worked into the story a character inhabiting a malen body - which needs to be shaved - yet is still unquestionably SHE to everyone.

No, I cheerfully admit I'm under-read in modern fantasy. I'm all caught up on Butcher's Dresden Files and enjoyed his Codex Alera; I thought Nora Jemisin's Broken Earth series was quite good; and Patrick Rothfuss, sure... but that's about it for fantasy, as I'm more of a science fiction guy. However, my wife and my son got me started on Mistborn and now I'm all-in on the Cosmere. I mean, I never joined a Jim Butcher forum, did I? No, I did not.

But... it's kind of my specialty! I might have been of great use to Wax against Miles.

My unpopular opinion? I worry Brandon is trying too hard to be woke. Social justice themes in Stormlight Archive (with no claims of completeness): Slavery and reparations. Racial privilege. Immigrant/refugee rights. Upending the social/economic class structure. Religion/atheism. Undoing traditional gender roles. Gender identity/fluidity. Physical disability. Mental illness. Major viewpoint characters demonstrate alcoholism, drug addiction, traumatic brain injury, autism spectrum disorder, major depression, post-traumatic stress disorder, dissociative identity disorder... you name it, someone has it. We even witness the birth of the support group on Roshar. Don't get me wrong: as a proud progressive liberal myself, I'm LOVING it. However, I find myself wondering “is it too much?” Has Brandon taken it upon himself to write not only the towering fantasy series of our generation, but the most supremely WOKE fantasy series of all time? If the SJW slant stands out so starkly to me, might it be souring the experience of other readers? Might it even be alienating people who would otherwise be potential fans? It sure won't stop ME from buying and reading books, though! ;-)

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/452-youtube-livestream-23/#e14523

While I'm absolutely all in on Stormlight, I still think Mistborn Era 2 is the most sublime reading experience of my life so far. CANNOT WAIT for the final chapter of Wax & Wayne!! Every single page Lift is on is precious to me. I wish I could be her when I grow up... although that's kind of ironic, isn't it? That's a tough one... right now I'll say Arcanum Unbounded. The Emperor's Soul, Edgedancer, Mistborn: Secret History - ALL SO GOOD. But ask tomorrow, you might get a different answer. Thanks for the warm welcome!

Anybody who TL;DRs this is missing out. Really interesting. I did not appreciate the level of parallel between the two. Given that Moash is completely obsessed with Kaladin, who seems ready to head out on a Shinovar adventure with Szeth, it certainly seems plausible there might be an opportunity for some exciting interactions. I'm looking forward to some fascinating conversations between Szeth, Kaladin and Nightblood... and I'm sure Nightblood might have some entertaining things to say to Moash as well. Szeth + Nightblood vs Moash + Jezrien's honorblade? Sign me up!

I’m late to the party, but I just want to say I have really got a lot out of this topic. I want to thank EVERYONE for sharing their perspectives on the issue of marginalized representation in fiction, and specifically about Renarin and Rlain. As someone who’s playing this game of life at the lowest level of difficulty - white, male, cis/het - I had what I thought were some clever insights regarding representation in Stormlight… “is Sanderson just trying to check all the woke boxes?” This discussion has helped me see that I need to examine my own biases some more. I’m really glad I didn’t start a new topic without doing some reading first! Again, to all of you who were brave enough to explain the details of your own struggles and worldviews, what these characters mean to you, and why their stories make sense, thank you. Is not one of the goals of fiction to help us make sense of our own stories?

Greetings, fellow Sanderson nerds, I exist! Long-time reader, both of Sanderson and of this community, but I finally decided to get off the bench and make an account.

Are these the only two options? I have no problem with S-are-a or s-air-a... but why not s-ar-a where the middle sound is the "arr" of "arrow" or "carrot"? Also, welcome - I'm also new here (but not to the cosmere).